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Uber Hit with $650M Employment Tax Bill in New Jersey

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Re: Uber Hit with $650M Employment Tax Bill in New Jersey

#151

Post by username90 »

9HZZRfNlpR wrote: post #148
username90 wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Uber basically controls every aspect of the entire process but let's people choose when they want to work. No, the main benefit is that Uber doesn't choose who can drive, anyone can sign up and start driving. I don't see how you can classify them as employees without Uber having any selection criteria at all for the drivers except that they have a valid drivers licence. The workers choose to work at Uber, Uber didn…

What about drivers rating?

Don't you start driving before you get a drivers rating? So it is not a blocker for you to start working there. After that isn't the drivers rating just a way for riders to kick misbehaving drivers off the platform? So it is the riders who fire the drivers, not Uber.

Re: Uber Hit with $650M Employment Tax Bill in New Jersey

#152

Post by zjaffee »

turc1656 wrote: post #101
listenallyall wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Taxi drivers don't set their own rates. What's the proper categorization?

The taxi analogy isn't the same. The rates are being set by the local government , not some non-government third-party whom they work with like perhaps the people who actually own the medallions (most are loaned out) or the people who lease out usage of the vehicles, etc. If those places were setting rates on what could be charged then I'd say there's an argument to be made. Also, let's not forget why the government…

In NYC and possibly other municipalities, the government sets the minimum rate for uber/lyft. Are they more or less of a contractor then?

Re: Uber Hit with $650M Employment Tax Bill in New Jersey

#153

Post by Xunxi »

epc wrote: post #89
listenallyall wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Source? At EWR a few weeks ago while waiting for luggage, I wandered over to the taxi stand. The quoted fare (there was no line, by the way) was twice that of either Uber or Lyft to the same destination.

Were you going to NYC (or anywhere in NY)? NY and NJ do not have a reciprocity agreement, so taxis from NYC are allowed to charge 2x the fare between NYC and EWR and the same for NJ taxis to NYC. Uber/Lyft can pickup / dropoff in either state and don't appear to operate under the same restrictions.

Lyft/Uber drivers from NJ can't pick up from NY. Whereas NY drivers can pick up from both states. NJ drivers have to drive back empty.

I had to cancel a trip from Fort Lee to Stony Brook when I discovered the driver had NJ plates.

They don't know where they're going until they arrive at location.

Re: Uber Hit with $650M Employment Tax Bill in New Jersey

#154

Post by chrisseaton »

AnimalMuppet wrote: post #132
kyleblarson wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At LAX you can walk 10-15 minutes to a hotel and get an Uber for way less than at the terminal.

You can walk out of LAX? Safely? I didn't think the entry road had sidewalks. Or is there some other route? And, given that those hotels have shuttles, why would you walk? Just take the hotel's bus. (Or are you feeling that that's not cool, because you're going there not to stay there, but just to take an Uber?)

Why are you so incredulous that anyone might choose to walk?

Re: Uber Hit with $650M Employment Tax Bill in New Jersey

#155

Post by walshemj »

username90 wrote: post #144
walshemj wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They are avoiding taxes which indirectly increases ours

Your comment doesn't make sense, are you saying that all independent contractors are tax avoiders and leech from society? Either the taxes independent contractors pay are fine and Uber paid a fair amount, or we need to raise the rates for all independent contractors.

They are not independent contractors they are employees its the employer side that is going missing.

An in the USA (vs the UK) actually self employed workers get screwed over getting 20% over a FTE i seen as good where in the UK I would go out for 3x my FTE sallery.

Re: Uber Hit with $650M Employment Tax Bill in New Jersey

#156

Post by mamon »

the_gastropod wrote: post #80
subsaharancoder wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Curious, in which world has taxation ever been for the benefit of the employee?

Aren't tariffs (import taxes) supposed to benefit employees?

Tariffs cause the price of imported goods to rise, which is bad for everyone, except this tiny minority of employees of the respective industry that get to keep their jobs and salaries.

Re: Uber Hit with $650M Employment Tax Bill in New Jersey

#157

Post by mamon »

username90 wrote: post #144
walshemj wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They are avoiding taxes which indirectly increases ours

Your comment doesn't make sense, are you saying that all independent contractors are tax avoiders and leech from society? Either the taxes independent contractors pay are fine and Uber paid a fair amount, or we need to raise the rates for all independent contractors.

Don't know how that works in US, but here in Europe the answer is yes, the main reason people become contractors is because taxes for contractors are lower than for employees, which means more take-home pay for the same cost for the employer.

Re: Uber Hit with $650M Employment Tax Bill in New Jersey

#158

Post by tnecniv »

nemo44x wrote: post #24

There's no escaping this from states like NJ, CA, IL, MA, and NY. These states (of which I am a member of) are broke with pension obligations waiting to bankrupt the government. Taxes are already high both on income and property so there's nowhere to go there. They have old infrastructures and although the citizens are heavily taxed, government can't make improvements in large part because of lifetime pension obligat…

Also in NJ, it's pretty well known that both businesses and individuals are flowing out of the state due to taxes when they are able.

The main reason my parents moved south when they retired wasn't the weather but the fact that they couldn't retire how they wanted with the property taxes in this state.

Re: Uber Hit with $650M Employment Tax Bill in New Jersey

#159

Post by microcolonel »

lost_access wrote: post #106
Shivetya wrote: post #40

I am really curious how they arrived at any of the numbers in this article. Seriously, what other large employers make it to hundred plus million per year? Are they just up and deciding that anyone who did one trip is now an employee? Is there a source that shows how much each company pays per year in this state? who else is equivalent? this isn't about protecting the drivers, this is about protecting the taxi indust…

Also the acid test is whether the drivers are qualified for unemployment benefits.

Do they not require independent contractors to contribute premiums for that? That's how it works here in Canada (same for mandatory pensions/"social security").

Re: Uber Hit with $650M Employment Tax Bill in New Jersey

#160

Post by microcolonel »

bcrosby95 wrote: post #61
nemo44x wrote: post #24

There's no escaping this from states like NJ, CA, IL, MA, and NY. These states (of which I am a member of) are broke with pension obligations waiting to bankrupt the government. Taxes are already high both on income and property so there's nowhere to go there. They have old infrastructures and although the citizens are heavily taxed, government can't make improvements in large part because of lifetime pension obligat…

When compared to other states, CA has a middle of the road per capita budget. It's not much more than Washington - which actually has zero income tax. CA has a high income tax rate, but property taxes aren't that high - they're pretty average for the nation. And the effective property tax rate is even lower due to prop 13. You can actually search this on many property tax websites - on average the effective tax rate…

Property taxes turn out to be a better way for states to do the bulk of tax collection. The focus on income taxes is probably a big part of why the property values in some of Cali are so insane.
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