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Don’t Call Me a Pessimist on Climate Change. I Am a Realist

thetyee.ca

21–30 of 241 posts

Re: Don’t Call Me a Pessimist on Climate Change. I Am a Realist

#21
post #2

Lots of assumptions baked in here. Chief among them is that renewables deployment will continue to be slower than new energy demand. If you look at the charts, this is pretty unlikely since the renewables trend is a consistent exponential increase year over year while the demand curve is very lumpy and mostly linear when averaged. Next is the assumption that renewables have to be deployed at grid scale, with the mate…

[deleted]

Re: Don’t Call Me a Pessimist on Climate Change. I Am a Realist

#22
The crux of the matter is that we need to drive thermodynamics backward at planetary scale. This is a fancy way of saying that we need to increase electricity generation by an integer factor beyond current global demand without producing net CO2. The list of existing energy sources capable of scaling like this that don't rely on burning carbon is extremely short: nuclear fission.

I don't see any possibility of the required power generation capability being built. Even if the economic resources were made available, which is at least plausible in the abstract, the irrational politics around nuclear power in the developed world would guarantee that there would be little actual progress.

Constructively addressing climate change means massively increasing power generation capacity as a primary input. Given the ample evidence that this is not politically achievable, I think it is fair to call pessimism "realism".

Re: Don’t Call Me a Pessimist on Climate Change. I Am a Realist

#23

> The modern world is deeply addicted to fossil fuels and green energy is no substitute. Am I wrong? Maybe not, but what would you suggest we do otherwise?

His only specific measure is this:

“A global population strategy to enable a smooth descent to the two to three billion that could live comfortably indefinitely within the biophysical means of nature.“

Same ‘ole Club of Rome, population control policies.

Re: Don’t Call Me a Pessimist on Climate Change. I Am a Realist

#24
post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Click to the next article: https://thetyee.ca/Analysis/2019/11/12/Climate-Crisis-Realis...

...where he effectively advocates to curb economic and population growth. Even if it was desirable, which it is not, it is never going to happen. For the sort of order of magnitude of decarbonisation that is required to meet the climate change requirement, not only to provide the current energy but future growth too, there isn't really any realistic solution other than nuclear energy.

I don't think you can just outright rule that as undesirable. Personally I strongly desire a reversal of the current rates of economic and population growth and I know many other people who do as well. Most of the opposition I see to this idea is from people who seem to value "progress" for its own sake as opposed to progress that actually has long term benefits.

Re: Don’t Call Me a Pessimist on Climate Change. I Am a Realist

#25
post #2

Lots of assumptions baked in here. Chief among them is that renewables deployment will continue to be slower than new energy demand. If you look at the charts, this is pretty unlikely since the renewables trend is a consistent exponential increase year over year while the demand curve is very lumpy and mostly linear when averaged. Next is the assumption that renewables have to be deployed at grid scale, with the mate…

> renewables deployment will continue to be slower than new energy demand.

Does renewable deployment cover new energy demand as well as the fossil fuels we are supposed not to use anymore?

> renewables deployments are offsetting dirtier production methods

Renewables take their toll on the environment too. Batteries and solar panels need fossil fuels for their production, and the mining of rare metals is an extremely polluting industry (and often delocalized in countries with little regulations).

> If you look at the charts

The charts I looked at suggested that there will be both an energy and an environmental crisis.

It's very hard to argue over this topic as all we can do is cite experts. Maybe I'm attracted to the most pessimistic authors? where to look to have the scientific consensus on this matter?

Re: Don’t Call Me a Pessimist on Climate Change. I Am a Realist

#26

When the Atlantic Multidecadal Oscillation and the Pacific Decadal Oscillation flip negative, and the deep, multi-decade solar minimum we are about to enter kicks in (it already has begun), we will see temps lower globally (and especially in the northern hemisphere). But of course, with this, we will be dealing with a set of problems much more difficult than warming. Warming is good for crops and humanity. Cold tempe…

Appreciate the unpopular "opinion".

The world oscillates. It has so for a long, long time. We should stop polluting not with some agenda to think we'll have an effect on global temperature, but to stop poisoning ourselves.

Re: Don’t Call Me a Pessimist on Climate Change. I Am a Realist

#27

The crux of the matter is that we need to drive thermodynamics backward at planetary scale. This is a fancy way of saying that we need to increase electricity generation by an integer factor beyond current global demand without producing net CO2. The list of existing energy sources capable of scaling like this that don't rely on burning carbon is extremely short: nuclear fission. I don't see any possibility of the re…

But necessity is the mother of invention, so we will probably invent a viable nuclear fission-based energy solution at the 11th hour, probably by someone who also helped cause the death of countless people through their earlier work[0]. I know this sounds absurdly far-fetched, but it’s pretty much par for the course for us humans.

[0] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fritz_Haber

Re: Don’t Call Me a Pessimist on Climate Change. I Am a Realist

#28
post #2

Lots of assumptions baked in here. Chief among them is that renewables deployment will continue to be slower than new energy demand. If you look at the charts, this is pretty unlikely since the renewables trend is a consistent exponential increase year over year while the demand curve is very lumpy and mostly linear when averaged. Next is the assumption that renewables have to be deployed at grid scale, with the mate…

However, the developing locations have the much larger populations.

I would talk also about different ecosystems. Some are more exigent in therms of energy than other.

If you run short of energy in january in many boreal areas (like Moscow or Bismark), and suddenly can't heat your home, you could face a serious danger of death. Gaz and electricity are a must. Same for Mojave or Death Valley if you can't use electricity to keep the temperature in acceptable limits.

There is a limit on how much the developped countries could lower their "lifestyle" (needs of energy) to get closer to the energy requirements of developping countries, just because winter here can be really harsh.

Hot areas (in developping and developped countries) will face the same problem but many developping countries in tropical areas would not have this problem (even if they could have other serious problems to solve, like the monsoon period)

The energy requirements can be very different in the different periods of the year also. If we talk about average requirements of energy that would be wrong.

Re: Don’t Call Me a Pessimist on Climate Change. I Am a Realist

#29
post #2

Lots of assumptions baked in here. Chief among them is that renewables deployment will continue to be slower than new energy demand. If you look at the charts, this is pretty unlikely since the renewables trend is a consistent exponential increase year over year while the demand curve is very lumpy and mostly linear when averaged. Next is the assumption that renewables have to be deployed at grid scale, with the mate…

> renewables deployment will continue to be slower than new energy demand. Does renewable deployment cover new energy demand as well as the fossil fuels we are supposed not to use anymore? > renewables deployments are offsetting dirtier production methods Renewables take their toll on the environment too. Batteries and solar panels need fossil fuels for their production, and the mining of rare metals is an extremely…

[deleted]

Re: Don’t Call Me a Pessimist on Climate Change. I Am a Realist

#30

When the Atlantic Multidecadal Oscillation and the Pacific Decadal Oscillation flip negative, and the deep, multi-decade solar minimum we are about to enter kicks in (it already has begun), we will see temps lower globally (and especially in the northern hemisphere). But of course, with this, we will be dealing with a set of problems much more difficult than warming. Warming is good for crops and humanity. Cold tempe…

It will be extremely interesting to me if cooling begins to happen on a global scale. It could very well be that we have shifted the world hotter, so this time the cooling is less and the next warming cycle is hotter. But if we have a decade(s) of global cooling trust in our scientists and institutions will be so absolutely, impossibly damaged that the commentary will be very interesting to observe objectively.
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