Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

When America Tried to Deport Its Radicals

newyorker.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

101–110 of 114 posts

Re: When America Tried to Deport Its Radicals

#101

Post by dragonwriter »

Braggadocious wrote: post #100
dragonwriter wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I respect your decision to be completely and utterly wrong That’s hilarious but... > The progressive movement was the movement of eugenics. There, again, have been a number of separate “progressive” movements in US history, eugenics was a minority view within one of them. But, while you are wrong here, it's not nearly so flagrantly wrong as: > And no, there was no group of white people saying white people are all g…

The progressive era was between the start of the industrial revolution and the start of WWII. >even white racists don't tend to think white people are all great. You are so committed to this modern liberal partisan revisionist historiography that you are willing to admit the narrative doesn't make any sense, and yet equally willing to keep at it. That's commitment. Irish, Italians, russians, and other "inferior" whit…

> Racism was not white vs black.

Racism was and is more complex than just white vs. black, but that wasn't your claim upthread that I have been arguing against.

What you claimed previously was that white was not considered a race before the 1920s. It absolutely was, and there are copious prominent invocations of white racial identity in US history prior to that time—as I've shown with the Cornerstone speech—and while racism is more complex than just white vs. black (and ideas of just who is white have evolved), white vs. black has been a key racial divide for the whole history of the country.

Re: When America Tried to Deport Its Radicals

#102

Post by [deleted] »

dragonwriter wrote: post #101
Braggadocious wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The progressive era was between the start of the industrial revolution and the start of WWII. >even white racists don't tend to think white people are all great. You are so committed to this modern liberal partisan revisionist historiography that you are willing to admit the narrative doesn't make any sense, and yet equally willing to keep at it. That's commitment. Irish, Italians, russians, and other "inferior" whit…

> Racism was not white vs black. Racism was and is more complex than just white vs. black, but that wasn't your claim upthread that I have been arguing against. What you claimed previously was that white was not considered a race before the 1920s. It absolutely was, and there are copious prominent invocations of white racial identity in US history prior to that time—as I've shown with the Cornerstone speech—and while…

[deleted]

Re: When America Tried to Deport Its Radicals

#103

Post by toasterlovin »

justinclift wrote: post #98
toasterlovin wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Alright, I'm out of here. Just for the record, though: only one of us offered any evidence to support their position. And it wasn't you.

As a data point, "first", "second", "third" world country (the term) means a different thing than you're both trying to convey. It's a literal grouping of countries by an old system, rather than meaning "economic" or "cultural" backwater. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Three-world_model As a 2nd data point, the median income response is about economic power. It's obviously possible to be economically strong whilst at…

[flagged]

Re: When America Tried to Deport Its Radicals

#104

Post by pandaman »

pjc50 wrote: post #99
pandaman wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Deportation is also an administrative punishment similar, since you brought this analogy, to impounding an illegally parked car. People who are anti-immigration are not demanding prison sentences for illegal aliens, are they? They demand the appropriate administrative action - deportation.

Deportation is significantly more disruptive to life than having your car impounded. It's also a lifetime punishment, since it nearly always bars you from further re-entry. Deporting people to certain countries can get them killed.

>Deportation is significantly more disruptive to life than having your car impounded.

Illegally being in the country and drawing on its resources is also significantly more disruptive to the life of the society than illegally parking a car so it is only natural.

>It's also a lifetime punishment, since it nearly always bars you from further re-entry.

It is not a punishment - nobody but citizens have a right to be in the country so no rights have been denied. Most people in the world are already being "punished" this way since they have no chance to get any visa to the US.

>Deporting people to certain countries can get them killed.

Deportation per se? How? Does it mean that if a car is impounded, and I get to the bad part of town where the impound lot usually is, and some undocumented immigrants or other oppressed minorities who live around those kinds of place rob/kill me then a car getting impounded can also can get me killed?

Re: When America Tried to Deport Its Radicals

#105

Post by Braggadocious »

dragonwriter wrote: post #101
Braggadocious wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The progressive era was between the start of the industrial revolution and the start of WWII. >even white racists don't tend to think white people are all great. You are so committed to this modern liberal partisan revisionist historiography that you are willing to admit the narrative doesn't make any sense, and yet equally willing to keep at it. That's commitment. Irish, Italians, russians, and other "inferior" whit…

> Racism was not white vs black. Racism was and is more complex than just white vs. black, but that wasn't your claim upthread that I have been arguing against. What you claimed previously was that white was not considered a race before the 1920s. It absolutely was, and there are copious prominent invocations of white racial identity in US history prior to that time—as I've shown with the Cornerstone speech—and while…

[flagged]

Re: When America Tried to Deport Its Radicals

#106

Post by justinclift »

toasterlovin wrote: post #103
justinclift wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a data point, "first", "second", "third" world country (the term) means a different thing than you're both trying to convey. It's a literal grouping of countries by an old system, rather than meaning "economic" or "cultural" backwater. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Three-world_model As a 2nd data point, the median income response is about economic power. It's obviously possible to be economically strong whilst at…

[flagged]

Thanks, wasn't aware of the change being regarded as anything official. Looks like it could be considered as such these days. :)

Re: When America Tried to Deport Its Radicals

#107

Post by dang »

toasterlovin wrote: post #30
Aloha wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm skeptical that Canada does better at assimilating, just based on first hand empirical evidence I've seen in Vancouver and Toronto. I would agree that Canada is doing better at lifting people out of poverty currently.

Canada doesn’t do better at lifting people out of poverty. They’re just more selective in who they let in and don’t have a huge second world country at their southern border.

Edit: I misread the comment. Sorry!

Please don't post flamebait to HN. We've had to ask you this before. We ban accounts that do it. I don't want to ban you, so please review https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html and fix this.

Re: When America Tried to Deport Its Radicals

#108

Post by dang »

toasterlovin wrote: post #95
teh_klev wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You casually slandered my entire country I made an observation about the state and its governance, not the inhabitants. These are two quite different things.

Alright, I'm out of here. Just for the record, though: only one of us offered any evidence to support their position. And it wasn't you.

Starting and perpetuating flamewars will get you banned here. Please don't do that on HN.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: When America Tried to Deport Its Radicals

#109

Post by dang »

teh_klev wrote: post #88
toasterlovin wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Median_income Basically the only countries (excluding city states) that beat the US by a significant margin are the Scandinavian countries. Sweden is the largest of those countries at about 10.5 million people. For a point of reference, that's about the size of Georgia, the 8th largest state. If you compare US median household income to the larger European countries (Germany, France, UK,…

From your first comment: "glib remarks" and "making them look like a biased hack to anybody who engages in serious thinking." > you look like an idiot who is too lazy to spend the the 5 minutes on Wikipedia Yes, thank you for insulting me a second time. And sorry, I don't regard Wikipedia as a reliable source, despite its selective citations. Median income is a single measurement, it doesn't mean an iota if your coun…

Please don't perpetuate flamewars on HN. We're trying to avoid that here.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: When America Tried to Deport Its Radicals

#110

Post by toasterlovin »

dang wrote: post #107
toasterlovin wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Canada doesn’t do better at lifting people out of poverty. They’re just more selective in who they let in and don’t have a huge second world country at their southern border.

Edit: I misread the comment. Sorry! Please don't post flamebait to HN. We've had to ask you this before. We ban accounts that do it. I don't want to ban you, so please review https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html and fix this.

Hey dang, I agree with your warnings down thread. I let the person I was responding to get to me and I should have conducted myself better. Sorry. I’m having a hard time figuring out what the issue is with this particular comment, though.
Post reply on HN