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Every American Car Brand Is on the Bottom Half of CR's Reliability Rankings

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Re: Every American Car Brand Is on the Bottom Half of CR's Reliability Rankings

#171

Post by [deleted] »

_xnmw wrote: post #62
rtpg wrote: post #5

This is a bit flame bait-y but I really feel like America is getting a super Galapagos effect compared to the rest of the world. Everything is super different and weird and kinda bad, and nobody seems to notice. I go to peoples houses in the US sometimes. Some of these houses are multimillion dollar homes. The doors are all terrible. The plumbing is crap. The furniture just feels bad. The cheapest studio apartment in…

It’s not until I was forced to live in Europe due to circumstances that I realized that there exists a much better life than the North American one. Even though I’m in the East (Ukraine), everything is better here. Everything, especially the food, the prices, and the lack of racial tensions and militarized police. The only thing I miss here is trying to fill the emptiness in life with same-day Amazon junk delivered t…

[deleted]

Re: Every American Car Brand Is on the Bottom Half of CR's Reliability Rankings

#172

Post by juskrey »

thomasedwards wrote: post #159
juskrey wrote: post #110

I have travelled US a lot and have rented a lot of different cars. Honestly I don't know a much about reliability (except I got several problems with top Nissan models), but comparing to US cars, the rest of the world cars just don't drive and are not fun. And then you got Tesla which is crap inside but for some reason is super fun and you want to buy it immediately.

Have you ever rented a Lamborghini?

Ok ok, for me fun means the car should deliver fun to all my family while traveling.

Re: Every American Car Brand Is on the Bottom Half of CR's Reliability Rankings

#173

Post by ptaipale »

SiempreViernes wrote: post #130
patrickk wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A lot of those parts are from third party suppliers (not that it excuses Tesla completely of course). I watched a video some time ago, where Musk was complaining that the big automotive parts suppliers simply didn't take Tesla seriously, and therefore it led to quality issues, in the video it was the quality of the sun flaps. It's probably due to Tesla shipping much lower volumes, and the big suppliers not being fami…

So Musk is saying their finished cars have problems because they get bad parts and they have to put those bad parts on their cars? I would have tough you did some quality assurance on all parts you put in the car, and not use the bad ones.

I really don't believe Tesla gets any worse parts than other manufacturers. Those parts come from the same production line. They are the same parts. Almost all of the automotive industry uses the same parts, chosen from a fairly limited variety of models, produced in great numbers.

The design of a car has a great impact on how long those parts last. It's easy to blame a parts supplier for faults that are because of your own design.

Let's take an example. The water that rains down on your windshield is cleared away by windscreen wipers. If the wiper motor or mechanism doesn't work, the car is not roadworthy.

Were does the water go from the windscreen? It flushes down along the edge into the scuttle between windscreen and bonnet (hood), and then usually goes down scuttle drains, to be released underneath the car. What happens if your scuttle drains are designed so that tree leaves that always fall on the windscreen in some places get stuck and block the scuttle drains? The water is not drained. Instead, the water level raises in the scuttle. The water may flush inside your car if the seams are not tight. Or the level just raises above the bearings of your windscreen wipers, you have a little pool in front of the windscreen.

So you have water in your wiper mechanism bearings. This water will freeze in the winter. It will push out and flush away any grease in the bearings. There will be corrosion. Eventually, your windscreen wiper won't move because the bearing is stuck.

Now, do you blame the wiper mechanism and bearing manufacturer (like Musk appears to do) or do you blame the design that floods the standard parts that everyone is using?

The former is of course tempting, but in the end, it's your responsibility to design and manufacture the car so that it keeps running for long enough.

Re: Every American Car Brand Is on the Bottom Half of CR's Reliability Rankings

#174

Post by twic »

blackhaz wrote: post #100
rtpg wrote: post #5

This is a bit flame bait-y but I really feel like America is getting a super Galapagos effect compared to the rest of the world. Everything is super different and weird and kinda bad, and nobody seems to notice. I go to peoples houses in the US sometimes. Some of these houses are multimillion dollar homes. The doors are all terrible. The plumbing is crap. The furniture just feels bad. The cheapest studio apartment in…

Hah! And I have completely the opposite experience - with the exception of modern American cars of course (still miss my 90s Chrysler Saratoga!) Europe is very often about the looks and the function is secondary. The most recent example - Vaillant vs Honeywell heating controllers. Vaillant looks fancy with decorative, smoothly flowing elements, knobs and fancy backlight, and the Honeywell unit is, well, spartan: big…

I wonder if this is because Vaillant is really a boiler company, so they are good at things involving gas and water, whereas Honeywell are an electronics company, so they're good at things involving electricity and information.

Re: Every American Car Brand Is on the Bottom Half of CR's Reliability Rankings

#175

Post by screye »

juskrey wrote: post #110

I have travelled US a lot and have rented a lot of different cars. Honestly I don't know a much about reliability (except I got several problems with top Nissan models), but comparing to US cars, the rest of the world cars just don't drive and are not fun. And then you got Tesla which is crap inside but for some reason is super fun and you want to buy it immediately.

Aren't british roadsters are classic driver's car ? (Mini coopers, Mazda MX-5, etc). Even in the sports car scene, it is Porsche that is lauded for being the most fun to drive.

American cars are usually more powerful but are much heavier and a bit sluggish on controls.

Re: Every American Car Brand Is on the Bottom Half of CR's Reliability Rankings

#176

Post by _iyig »

rtpg wrote: post #5

This is a bit flame bait-y but I really feel like America is getting a super Galapagos effect compared to the rest of the world. Everything is super different and weird and kinda bad, and nobody seems to notice. I go to peoples houses in the US sometimes. Some of these houses are multimillion dollar homes. The doors are all terrible. The plumbing is crap. The furniture just feels bad. The cheapest studio apartment in…

As an American, I agree with your observations. Average food quality was higher when I lived in Europe, even in parts of the former Yugoslavia. Instant hot water was also more common; American homes typically use tank-style water heaters which take a minute to warm up once you open the faucet.

Re: Every American Car Brand Is on the Bottom Half of CR's Reliability Rankings

#177

Post by _xnmw »

screye wrote: post #153
_xnmw wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s not until I was forced to live in Europe due to circumstances that I realized that there exists a much better life than the North American one. Even though I’m in the East (Ukraine), everything is better here. Everything, especially the food, the prices, and the lack of racial tensions and militarized police. The only thing I miss here is trying to fill the emptiness in life with same-day Amazon junk delivered t…

> lack of racial tensions Is this because of lack of diversity or actually accommodating masses ? Genuine question.

Both. Maybe the latter is caused by the former.

Re: Every American Car Brand Is on the Bottom Half of CR's Reliability Rankings

#178

Post by huffmsa »

tibbydudeza wrote: post #136
huffmsa wrote: post #52

> CR says Chrysler’s Pacifica was one that contributed to the drop in rankings thanks to the minivan’s infotainment and transmission issues. Every single "downgrade" I read about is either infotainment or transmission or both. Except Honda, which apparently has shit locks on it's kid hauler. I'm a bit skeptical of consumer reports after actually reading it. My car, a Subaru WRX is given low marks for "stiff ride and…

Yep you buy a WRX for the drivetrain and rally heritage ... the terrible plastic interior was a moot point.

The seats are comfy enough, the steering wheel is beefy, the only point of failure I've had is the battery. Otherwise, it's exactly what it's supposed to be.

CR give my other car, a Jaguar F-Pace low marks for "loud engine and cabin, stiff choppy ride and bad infotainment."

Which to me sounds like a lot of soccer mom's thought they were getting "luxury" utility vehicle but accidentally purchase a 350hp supercharged v6 "sport" utility vehicle.

Cars are for driving, not "infotainment".

Re: Every American Car Brand Is on the Bottom Half of CR's Reliability Rankings

#179

Post by Daniel_sk »

blkhawk wrote: post #169
Daniel_sk wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can set a temperature on a thermostatic shower head and you just adjust the flow of water. Most newer bathrooms have thermostatic shower heads in Europe. But even the old ones with hot + cold valves allow you to not only set the temperature but also the flow. I think most US showers have just a single faucet where you can control the temperature but not the pressure/flow. You always have to go from cold to hot (i…

those are common in Europe too. A Thermostat is nice but it does not solve the "first water" problem. A shower will always run cold at first.

I guess it's a regional thing, the single "US" faucet is something I guess no one in Slovakia or Czech Republic has seen. I remember when we were on a first US business trip and it was hilarious to find out that I was not the only one of the group who tried to find Youtube videos how to control that thing and also to switch between the shower head and the tap. The second thing was that after having a shower I wanted to switch on the bed lamp - the switch was a small knob which I tried to push but nothing worked, then I found out I had to turn it in any direction to cycle between on and off.

Re: Every American Car Brand Is on the Bottom Half of CR's Reliability Rankings

#180

Post by navigatesol »

tim333 wrote: post #44

A lot of the issues may come down to whether management prioritize financial engineering / making huge bonuses / pleasing wall street vs making good vehicles. The same with Boeing - they used to be run by engineers who wanted to make great planes and then the shifted control to finance guys in Chicago who wanted to make big profits. You see the effect a bit with Tesla where I'm sure Musk would love to focus on qualit…

>A lot of the issues may come down to whether management prioritize financial engineering / making huge bonuses / pleasing wall street vs making good vehicles. The same with Boeing..

It's a funny thing to me that no one ever points this out in advance. Where were the articles about Boeing's move from an engineering culture to a financial one? Instead, we wait for the natural cycle of a business to arrive, then make up some answer, like "financialization" to explain it.

How come a hacker site doesn't acknowledge how difficult it is to "stay on top" as a business?

>You see the effect a bit with Tesla where I'm sure Musk would love to focus on quality but has to rush things out to make decent quarterly numbers or risk going bust by not getting ongoing financing

Again, more post hoc reasoning.

Elon Musk negotiated the biggest corporate pay package in history, but he didn't tie it to product quality, did he? Maybe that's why he focuses so much on share price and market cap and quarterly numbers? Nah, couldn't be...

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