Airbnb Plans to Verify Every Listing • Hacker News Board

Re: Airbnb Plans to Verify Every Listing

#101

Post by duxup » Thu, Nov 07, 2019, 2:40 AM UTC

RHSeeger wrote: post #67

greggman2 wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not that simple > does this listing have a stove Guest: Well yes but it doesn't work. Or, well yes but the flame shut off after 2 minutes AirBnB: Sucks to be you but it has a stove so not a lie > does this listing have wifi Well yes but they say it's only got 1meg data so it will run out in probably 2 days and we booked the place for a month. AirBnb: Sucks to be you but it has wifi so not a lie > does this listi…

I'm be curious if you could have pushed back on the bedrooms one. The term "bedroom" has a legal definition in many places (ex, must have door and closed).

It might but I'm not sure Airbnb has a definition.

Re: Airbnb Plans to Verify Every Listing

#102

Post by arcticbull » Thu, Nov 07, 2019, 2:41 AM UTC

Analemma_ wrote: post #78

situational87 wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's almost like we are intentionally bending over backwards to avoid hiring some human beings to do some real fucking work. When did this become the mantra of every tech company? Any time a job is created it's viewed as an unfortunate mistake or side effect? Who are we even building all this for?

The promise to investors of "tech companies" is zero marginal cost, and hence infinite scalability. As soon as you have to have to incur meatspace costs per transaction instead of doing it all in software, these sky-high unicorn valuations go out the window.

Exactly. Frequently the ones who deflate are ones that hadn’t figured out the zero marginal cost bit in time.

Re: Airbnb Plans to Verify Every Listing

#103

Post by abawany » Thu, Nov 07, 2019, 2:42 AM UTC

toss1 wrote: post #94

AirBnB's existing guest verification process loks onerous, but is trivial to work-around. For some reservations, they demand to have your Driver's License image, both sides (to include he various barcodes, etc.) and some other items. For a friend who did not want the risk of having their full set of data floating around out there, I used some readily available & free tools to make some (self-consistent) edits to the…

This crazy requirement for ID upload was the reason why I never completed my AirBnB profile. I wish I had thought of what you did. Instead, I use HomeAway, which didn't have such a nasty scheme for validation. It too has similar problems as AirBnB with shady hosts, last minute cancellations, etc. though.

Re: Airbnb Plans to Verify Every Listing

#104

Post by duxup » Thu, Nov 07, 2019, 2:42 AM UTC

umvi wrote: post #14

Would it kill AirBnB to do random (or even algorithmically-determined) audits? Auditor signs up for a night in your house. Let's say your listing has fake pictures or fake amenities. Or you try to bait and switch the auditor by having them stay in some crappy other property because the main listing "is having plumbing problems". Bam, audit failed, your account is frozen, your listings are removed, and you are banned…

They don't want to know.

All those unfortunate things for you and me are risk mitigation/ cost savings for them.

Re: Airbnb Plans to Verify Every Listing

#105

Post by Terretta » Thu, Nov 07, 2019, 2:46 AM UTC

ars wrote: post #98

libria wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Door + closet + fire-escapable window are a few reqs around here.

The closet part is not actually true, it's a commonly believed myth. There may be a few rare localities that require it, but it's not normally required. Rather the definition requires a certain size of the room.

In a certain US jurisdiction I have a room with a bed in it I can call a “nanny’s room” but I cannot call a bedroom on a real estate listing, as the closet for that room is through another door in a sort of hall.

In Europe though, where armoires are a thing, and I actually can’t remember living in any home that had a closet in any room with a bed, I don’t see closet being in the definition.

Re: Airbnb Plans to Verify Every Listing

#106

Post by Terretta » Thu, Nov 07, 2019, 2:49 AM UTC

dickeytk wrote: post #100

RustyBucket wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In many places (e.g. in Europe) there is no standard definition of bedroom at all. Rather generic room, which is space surrounded by walls.

I would be very surprised if that was the case. It's certainly not in the US or UK: http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1985/68/part/X in the US it"s that it needs a window + closet I think.

From sibling comment:

In continental Europe, where armoires are a thing, I actually can’t remember living in any home that had a closet in any room with a bed, so I can’t see closet being in the definition of bedroom.

Re: Airbnb Plans to Verify Every Listing

#107

Post by dredmorbius » Thu, Nov 07, 2019, 2:51 AM UTC

buboard wrote: post #56

ogre_codes wrote: post #12

From the comment in the article it sounds like they are trying to offload the cost/ effort of verifying listings to their customers as well: " But he said the process would involve asking users whether the information in certain listings turned out to be accurate " So when he says AirBNB is going to verify every listing, he doesn't actually mean they are paying people to do it...

That's practically asking for fraud. There are 6M listings. How much would it cost them to do the right thing and have them even cursorily inspected? Inspectors would of course have to pose as customers. Damn these sharing startups are tight fisted

"Secret shoppers" are already A Thing.

https://www.secretshopper.com

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mystery_shopping

Re: Airbnb Plans to Verify Every Listing

#108

Post by unlinked_dll » Thu, Nov 07, 2019, 2:54 AM UTC

dzhiurgis wrote: post #73

umvi wrote: post #14

Would it kill AirBnB to do random (or even algorithmically-determined) audits? Auditor signs up for a night in your house. Let's say your listing has fake pictures or fake amenities. Or you try to bait and switch the auditor by having them stay in some crappy other property because the main listing "is having plumbing problems". Bam, audit failed, your account is frozen, your listings are removed, and you are banned…

Freeze? If they do an audit like that they better sue these criminals to at least a year in jail.

Thats absurd. Civil tort never results in jail time unless someone commits a criminal offense during the proceedings such as perjury or contempt.

At most AirBNB would have to prove damages, which would be difficult since they profit off dishonesty, or have proceedings that result in consequences for the hosts.

For example I’ve had multiple hosts that lie about the address of their tenancy because they’re renting and not allowed to sublet or short term rent the property as a term of their lease.

Verifying the listings, including deeds/leases would fix this.

Re: Airbnb Plans to Verify Every Listing

#109

Post by paxys » Thu, Nov 07, 2019, 2:58 AM UTC

umvi wrote: post #14

Would it kill AirBnB to do random (or even algorithmically-determined) audits? Auditor signs up for a night in your house. Let's say your listing has fake pictures or fake amenities. Or you try to bait and switch the auditor by having them stay in some crappy other property because the main listing "is having plumbing problems". Bam, audit failed, your account is frozen, your listings are removed, and you are banned…

While lots of listings have minor discrepancies, I'm sure outright scams (like the ones described in the recent article) are pretty rare. I doubt doing random audits is going to have a significant enough success rate in finding them to make a difference.

Re: Airbnb Plans to Verify Every Listing

#110

Post by x0x0 » Thu, Nov 07, 2019, 3:00 AM UTC

greggman2 wrote: post #65

jobigoud wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wait, I use Airbnb both as a guest and a host and it already works like this? You list amenities. Then the platform asks guests "does this listing have a stove, does it have a carbon monoxyde detector", etc. Then the platform query the host "guests have mentioned you have a stove, is it correct?". I just got such a confirmation request on our listing today.

It's not that simple > does this listing have a stove Guest: Well yes but it doesn't work. Or, well yes but the flame shut off after 2 minutes AirBnB: Sucks to be you but it has a stove so not a lie > does this listing have wifi Well yes but they say it's only got 1meg data so it will run out in probably 2 days and we booked the place for a month. AirBnb: Sucks to be you but it has wifi so not a lie > does this listi…

We arrived for a conference to an AirBnB and discovered when arriving at 10pm that it was likely illegal. ie got warnings about making noise and multiple people coming in simultaneously with suitcases, etc.

But your choices are either:

1 - pick a fight at 10pm, probably fuck around with AirBnB's shit customer support, maybe if lucky get to sleep at an alternate place by 1 or 2 am, then feel like utter garbage for the next 3 days;

2 - deal (with the implied: no more airbnb on business trips...)