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How to Steal a Billion

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Re: How to Steal a Billion

#81

Post by ianleeclark »

rayiner wrote: post #75
ianleeclark wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> We spend way too much time worrying about the wealth of a small group of people that, in the end, doesn’t add up to that large a fraction of total wealth or income. People focus on billionaires due to the fact that they are the most stark representation of the deeply unequal society in which they live. Wealth inequality is very real, please refer to the following: https://www.stlouisfed.org/open-vault/2019/august/w…

> People focus on billionaires due to the fact that they are the most stark representation of the deeply unequal society in which they live. Wealth inequality is very real, please refer to the following: https://www.stlouisfed.org/open-vault/2019/august/wealth-ine ... It's a rhetorical device It's a rhetorical device that distracts from real problems and real solutions. Look at Warren's wealth tax proposal. It's blat…

> Zuckerberg doesn't work? Buffet doesn't work? Kylie Jenner doesn't work? > don't have to work

One of these things is not like the other. Don't be so slippery, please.

Re: How to Steal a Billion

#82

Post by lalaithion »

christiansakai wrote: post #55
CptFribble wrote: post #13

That's the funny thing about Billions-with-a-b: normal thinking about money and value just doesn't work IMO. The Vision Fund is going to lose ~$19 billion. But Masa Son still controls over $80 billion. That's more wealth and power than almost any human being will ever have in history, ever. At that point the numbers don't even matter. Maybe Neumann took Masa Son for $50 billion. Who cares? A person can live in the US…

I am curious on how a person can live in the USA for their whole lives for $3 - 5 million. Serious question.

Invest 3 million in the stock market. A safe withdrawal rate (historically, you would never go bankrupt if you did this, so you could survive 2008 without even worrying) is 3.5% per year.

3.5% of 3 million is 105k. That puts you in the 87th percentile of Americans.

Re: How to Steal a Billion

#83

Post by psb217 »

christiansakai wrote: post #55
CptFribble wrote: post #13

That's the funny thing about Billions-with-a-b: normal thinking about money and value just doesn't work IMO. The Vision Fund is going to lose ~$19 billion. But Masa Son still controls over $80 billion. That's more wealth and power than almost any human being will ever have in history, ever. At that point the numbers don't even matter. Maybe Neumann took Masa Son for $50 billion. Who cares? A person can live in the US…

I am curious on how a person can live in the USA for their whole lives for $3 - 5 million. Serious question.

Invest conservatively and pull out 2-3% per year. This should provide you with, conservatively, 50k-100k per year in post-tax cash (inflation adjusted) to spend as you like. Historically, you should be able to withdraw at this rate "indefinitely" with very low risk of zeroing out your funds.

Re: How to Steal a Billion

#84

Post by MetalGuru »

ianleeclark wrote: post #65
rayiner wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Most people out here are sweating medical bills in the low $10,000's, while the news is talking about billions being gained and lost in the span of a few weeks - so fast it makes you wonder if that amount of wealth really even existed in the first place. If people lose confidence in the system because of that it’s because they can’t multiply. Billionaires are very rich compared to middle class people, but there are…

> We spend way too much time worrying about the wealth of a small group of people that, in the end, doesn’t add up to that large a fraction of total wealth or income. People focus on billionaires due to the fact that they are the most stark representation of the deeply unequal society in which they live. Wealth inequality is very real, please refer to the following: https://www.stlouisfed.org/open-vault/2019/august/w…

> So the group of people who leverage capital to sustain themselves and don't have to work have lower net income than the group of people who have to work to have a roof over their head?

He’s talking about the aggregate income earned by the group. So the delta in individual incomes is offset by the massive delta in group sizes.

Re: How to Steal a Billion

#85

Post by Consultant32452 »

blurbleblurble wrote: post #57
shantly wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If people lose confidence in the system because of that it’s because they can’t multiply. Elizabeth Warren’s new health plan will cost $50 trillion over ten years. Middle class Americans make $8 trillion a year, compared to about $130 billion for America’s billionaires. To anyone who might take this as an indication Warren's plan will increase HC spending, if we do nothing average yearly HC spending for the 2020s i…

People obsessed with "how will we pay for it" just don't understand. The skewed distribution of wealth creates a situation where people don't have time and energy left over from their hustle to take care of themselves and to take care of each other in basic ways. People are sacrificing to the gods of capitalism. Correcting the skewed distribution of wealth would shift agency back to people to mind the business of liv…

>The skewed distribution of wealth creates a situation where people don't have time and energy left over from their hustle to take care of themselves and to take care of each other in basic ways.

Can you help me understand this better? Because I see this sentiment often. I'm just gonna do some quick math... Bezos + Gates + Musk + Zuckerberg = let's round up to $300 Billion. Divide that evenly among the 327 million US population. I'd get $917. Do you believe that I will take better care of myself or be a better father in the long run if I get a one-time bonus of $917?

Re: How to Steal a Billion

#86

Post by sharkmerry »

hanniabu wrote: post #73
ksdale wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's especially interesting, because although a billion dollars is a staggering amount of money for one person to possess, if you distributed the wealth of the world out to every single person evenly, it would only be something like $50,000 per person (based on some quick Googling), which is a life changing amount of money, to be sure, but it's a one time deal. It's not $50,000 per year of income, it's $50,000, perio…

From my calculations of a total redistribution of money, which will be more than just redistributing funds from the wealthy, you'd have this: Global money: $90,400,000,000,000 Global population: 7,742,131,000 Money per person: ~$11,650

Which is almost the poverty level of the US or >14x the global poverty level.

Re: How to Steal a Billion

#87

Post by selectodude »

hanniabu wrote: post #79
selectodude wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

5 million over 100 years is $50,000/yr. The median household income is just over $60,000. I think you'd do fine.

As seen over the past few decades, $50k doesn't go as far as it used to, and I see no reason not to expect the same in the future compared to now. In 30 years $50k might be poverty level income.

Sure but that ignores everything about compound interest. And most people don’t live too 100. Consider it reducto ad absurdum on my part.

Re: How to Steal a Billion

#88

Post by boring_twenties »

hanniabu wrote: post #79
selectodude wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

5 million over 100 years is $50,000/yr. The median household income is just over $60,000. I think you'd do fine.

As seen over the past few decades, $50k doesn't go as far as it used to, and I see no reason not to expect the same in the future compared to now. In 30 years $50k might be poverty level income.

That's why you invest the $5m, not just keep it in cash.

Re: How to Steal a Billion

#89

Post by ianleeclark »

MetalGuru wrote: post #84
ianleeclark wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> We spend way too much time worrying about the wealth of a small group of people that, in the end, doesn’t add up to that large a fraction of total wealth or income. People focus on billionaires due to the fact that they are the most stark representation of the deeply unequal society in which they live. Wealth inequality is very real, please refer to the following: https://www.stlouisfed.org/open-vault/2019/august/w…

> So the group of people who leverage capital to sustain themselves and don't have to work have lower net income than the group of people who have to work to have a roof over their head? He’s talking about the aggregate income earned by the group. So the delta in individual incomes is offset by the massive delta in group sizes.

Huh, this is interesting. I completely missed the fact that these two groups are massively differently sized. So his 8 trillion vs 130 billion is laughable. If you define the "middle class" as roughly 50 percent of the population (this is pretty low considering how this word is actually used), then the billionaires 130 billion greatly outstrips the 8 trillion per person. There's just shy of 600 billionaires in the US vs roughly 160 million "middle class" then the per individual income is 50k vs 222k. Pretty Stark even when you completely disregard the wealth elephant in the room

Re: How to Steal a Billion

#90

Post by oblio »

Consultant32452 wrote: post #85
blurbleblurble wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People obsessed with "how will we pay for it" just don't understand. The skewed distribution of wealth creates a situation where people don't have time and energy left over from their hustle to take care of themselves and to take care of each other in basic ways. People are sacrificing to the gods of capitalism. Correcting the skewed distribution of wealth would shift agency back to people to mind the business of liv…

>The skewed distribution of wealth creates a situation where people don't have time and energy left over from their hustle to take care of themselves and to take care of each other in basic ways. Can you help me understand this better? Because I see this sentiment often. I'm just gonna do some quick math... Bezos + Gates + Musk + Zuckerberg = let's round up to $300 Billion. Divide that evenly among the 327 million US…

I find it a bit naive that the whole system would work like some sort of highway robbery :-) I'm pretty sure that's not what's meant when people talk of "wealth redistribution". Your argument looks like a strawman to me.
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