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Electron 7.0

electronjs.org

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Re: Electron 7.0

#281

Post by pjmlp »

AnIdiotOnTheNet wrote: post #279
pjmlp wrote: post #261

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Indeed, that is why Microsoft has created teams to support React Native for macOS and Windows, on Windows case it makes use of UWP, which new roadmap (WinUI 3.0) was announced at BUILD 2019, with more details to come up on Ignite. Yeah, Microsoft bashing never grows old.

Yeah ok, fair point. Someone at Microsoft cares a bit about Windows, just not anybody working on the UX bits.

Given the market size of laptops, 2-1 hybrids and graphical workstations running Windows, the UI/UX toolings that are available, I fail to see what you mean.

Re: Electron 7.0

#282

Post by nicoburns »

pookeh wrote: post #203
m_fayer wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think this peaked some time around 2015. Back then, I remember many developers getting up in arms about following Apple's guidelines to a T, or insisting that Android apps look like a hyperactive stack of colorful paper cutouts under a direct light. Since then, I think many of us have gotten tired of looking at overdesigned sameness that by now we all know will age quickly. Programmers no longer see the sense in ch…

You are right but at the same time I am willing to bet you 5 years later someone else will make the opposite argument and be upvoted the same. It's a pendulum.

I'd bet on the next UI standard being a cross-platform library. Electron-like, but with much more efficient stack, and with binding to multiple languages.

Re: Electron 7.0

#283

Post by AnIdiotOnTheNet »

pjmlp wrote: post #281
AnIdiotOnTheNet wrote: post #279

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah ok, fair point. Someone at Microsoft cares a bit about Windows, just not anybody working on the UX bits.

Given the market size of laptops, 2-1 hybrids and graphical workstations running Windows, the UI/UX toolings that are available, I fail to see what you mean.

I mean the experience of using Windows has dramatically declined in the past 5 years. Forced Windows updates was a terrible idea, updates break things much more often, the start menu has ads in it by default, start menu search does strange things, it's possible to break the start menu, if you unpin an application from the task bar while it has running instances and then re-pin it you'll sometimes end up with multiple icons, the new settings panels are slower and less capable than the old ones...

Re: Electron 7.0

#284

Post by pfranz »

jimnotgym wrote: post #273
dwaite wrote: post #233

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Microsoft Office has gotten way better over the years. They used to design the UX around the idea of "Office Users", not "Mac Users"

This is very frustrating when supporting a mixed team of Mac and PC users on office. I would prefer it to be the same everywhere.

And that's the problem. I imagine those Mac users chose it because they like the OS' conventions. Photoshop seems to have gone the other way from using OS conventions to doing their own thing the same on each platform. iTunes, which didn't always follow macOS conventions, did port everything to Windows.

Re: Electron 7.0

#285

Post by brycesbeard »

inferiorhuman wrote: post #188
brycesbeard wrote: post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s clear that you aren’t their intended audience. Due to a choice you have made to not use a more common platform. Your responses sound like you’re upset; why? You made your choice. They made theirs. Accept the reality, accept the trade offs, or make changes. Complaining about the decisions made by other people isn’t useful.

Due to a choice you have made to not use a more common platform. Actually I'm primarily using MacOS as a desktop these days. I've happily paid for a variety of apps (e.g. Omnigraffle, Monodraw, Lightroom). Your responses sound like you’re upset; why? You made your choice. Beyond the usability issues that constantly dismissed out of hand by developers, Electron is a crass and dishonest attempt at redefining portable a…

> Electron is a crass and dishonest attempt at redefining portable and cross-platform to include a very narrow selection of platforms.

You don’t think the crass and dishonest part is a story that you’re telling yourself? To me, it’s an engineering trade off. There is no need to criticize what others have chosen, and afaict, no evidence to support this hyperbolic questioning of their intentions.

Re: Electron 7.0

#286

Post by mlvljr »

pjmlp wrote: post #260
wwright wrote: post #213

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As someone who has worked a lot with both Qt and React at my current job, I feel that React is significantly easier for almost everyone. Qt’s complexity negates a lot of its benefits in most hands.

Maybe it is my age showing off, but React easier than Qt??!

Does not crash!

Re: Electron 7.0

#287

Post by m_fayer »

nicoburns wrote: post #282
pookeh wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are right but at the same time I am willing to bet you 5 years later someone else will make the opposite argument and be upvoted the same. It's a pendulum.

I'd bet on the next UI standard being a cross-platform library. Electron-like, but with much more efficient stack, and with binding to multiple languages.

I'd bet on "if you can't beat em', join em". Reactive component-based architectures a la React/Vue have won. The DOM has won for the view layer too. And with wasm, you get your bindings to multiple languages. See: Blazor (it's just the first, more are coming). As for desktop apps that could benefit from proper concurrency, lack of a browser sandbox, full system access, etc. - server side Blazor is quietly pioneering a weird new paradigm - essentially running a headless browser in a regular process with full privileges, and then only doing vdom diffing inside the browser.

Re: Electron 7.0

#288

Post by nicoburns »

m_fayer wrote: post #287
nicoburns wrote: post #282

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd bet on the next UI standard being a cross-platform library. Electron-like, but with much more efficient stack, and with binding to multiple languages.

I'd bet on "if you can't beat em', join em". Reactive component-based architectures a la React/Vue have won. The DOM has won for the view layer too. And with wasm, you get your bindings to multiple languages. See: Blazor (it's just the first, more are coming). As for desktop apps that could benefit from proper concurrency, lack of a browser sandbox, full system access, etc. - server side Blazor is quietly pioneering…

> The DOM has won for the view layer too

As a front-end dev, I'm not entirely sure I agree with that. The DOM has some annoying performance limitations, and I'd love to be able to use something better for rendering. I think what the DOM has shown, is that cross-platform and the ability to easily do custom look and feel are crucial.

Re: Electron 7.0

#289

Post by brylie »

maxbrunsfeld wrote: post #65
windsurfer wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, Slack is currently taking almost 3 GB of memory on my machine. Not entirely sure if that's due to Electron or Slack, but I have never found an Electron app that didn't consume vast swathes of memory. https://imgur.com/GscRFD7.png

It is not because of Electron. An empty Atom window containing 5 source code files consumes about 120MB of RAM. For comparison with native apps, an empty iTerm2 window uses 100MB, and so does an empty Notes.app window. The base memory footprint imposed by Chromium is not that significant.

How much memory does a "hello world" app use?
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