Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

German government expands subsidies for electric cars

dw.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

21–30 of 154 posts

Re: German government expands subsidies for electric cars

#21

Post by sparkling »

I doubt this is going to do anything.

About 50% of the population in Germany are renters, not owners. And for the other 50% owners, many just own a unit in a multi family building, not the whole property.

For manyyyyy of these people there simply is no option to conveniently fast charge their electric vehicle at home. No renter will want to invest in a pricey wallbox at a property that they don't own - even if the landlord would allow such a wallbox to be installed (most don't want any modifications to their building). And for the apartment/unit owners, a German court has decided that all the other unit owners must agree to such a wallbox being installed, so that's another obstacle.

Re: German government expands subsidies for electric cars

#22

Post by dillz »

Blatant and obvious lobbying by the extremely powerful German car industry. The subsidy includes premium brand plug-in hybrids such as BMW 330e and Mercedes C class - i.e. typical company cars that will very rarely use the electric engine. As gibolt mentioned, it also helps VW selling their new models.

Why not subsidize public transport instead? Why has the German government been unable to make (useful) climate protection laws in the past years, but these odd subsidies are no problem?

Re: German government expands subsidies for electric cars

#23

Post by cbmuser »

gibolt wrote: post #15

It is pretty blatant that they are increasing it by 50% to support Volkswagen's conversion to electric. Most of the other comments seem quite negative. It is protectionism, but it applies to most electric cars and is a step in the right direction. It is late and selfish, but better than the alternative.

Volkswagen isn't going to convert to electric anytime soon.

Electric cars only make 1% of the annual car registrations in Germany and 0.18% of the total number of cars registered.

In fact, Volkswagen is planning a new factory for cars with combustion engines in Turkey. It's just currently put on hold due to the conflict at the Syrian border.

Re: German government expands subsidies for electric cars

#24

Post by wongarsu »

lumberjack wrote: post #18
wil421 wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are the Chinese EV golf carts I mean cars allowed in Germany? I thought their safety requirements were pretty tight. I can’t imagine some of them making it on the autobahn.

Cannot be more of a death trap than a Renault Twizzy which I see quite often around the city, or any motorcycle for that matter. As long as they don't market it as a normal car, I don't see why it shouldn't be allowed.

Motocycles require a different driving license in Germany, which is harder to get and for the powerful motorcycles has stricter age requirements (24 if you want >95 horsepower)

Re: German government expands subsidies for electric cars

#25

Post by fluffything »

gibolt wrote: post #15

It is pretty blatant that they are increasing it by 50% to support Volkswagen's conversion to electric. Most of the other comments seem quite negative. It is protectionism, but it applies to most electric cars and is a step in the right direction. It is late and selfish, but better than the alternative.

Not only VW, any company can opt-in to the subsidies: the state pays half and the company the other half.

What's funny is how the requirement of a <= 60k EUR car price means that those buying a Tesla won't get any subsidies. It's kind of understandable though: in Germany most cars are sold in the 10-20k EUR range, so it would be political suicide to create a subsidy to pay for what most citizens consider a luxury. Subsidizing cars in the 40k-60k EUR is quite outrageous already IMO.

Re: German government expands subsidies for electric cars

#26

Post by mooktakim »

sparkling wrote: post #21

I doubt this is going to do anything. About 50% of the population in Germany are renters, not owners. And for the other 50% owners, many just own a unit in a multi family building, not the whole property. For manyyyyy of these people there simply is no option to conveniently fast charge their electric vehicle at home. No renter will want to invest in a pricey wallbox at a property that they don't own - even if the la…

Solution to these problems will come. Its a chicken & egg problem. I live in a flat in London and thinking of similar issues with electric cars. Maybe 20min supercharging every couple of weeks is enough for my weekend driving. I'm hoping soon every lamp post will have a charging plug.

Re: German government expands subsidies for electric cars

#27

Post by wongarsu »

cbmuser wrote: post #23
gibolt wrote: post #15

It is pretty blatant that they are increasing it by 50% to support Volkswagen's conversion to electric. Most of the other comments seem quite negative. It is protectionism, but it applies to most electric cars and is a step in the right direction. It is late and selfish, but better than the alternative.

Volkswagen isn't going to convert to electric anytime soon. Electric cars only make 1% of the annual car registrations in Germany and 0.18% of the total number of cars registered. In fact, Volkswagen is planning a new factory for cars with combustion engines in Turkey. It's just currently put on hold due to the conflict at the Syrian border.

Of course a giant company like Volkswagen won't turn around on a dime, it will be a slow transition; and probably never a complete one.

But just from the fact that electric cars have a 5 times higher share of new registrations than of existing cars shows that it's a growing market, and adoption curves usually grow exponentially until you approach market saturation. Volkswagen is doing a lot to get a bigger piece of that pie.

Re: German government expands subsidies for electric cars

#28

Post by the-dude »

fluffything wrote: post #25
gibolt wrote: post #15

It is pretty blatant that they are increasing it by 50% to support Volkswagen's conversion to electric. Most of the other comments seem quite negative. It is protectionism, but it applies to most electric cars and is a step in the right direction. It is late and selfish, but better than the alternative.

Not only VW, any company can opt-in to the subsidies: the state pays half and the company the other half. What's funny is how the requirement of a <= 60k EUR car price means that those buying a Tesla won't get any subsidies. It's kind of understandable though: in Germany most cars are sold in the 10-20k EUR range, so it would be political suicide to create a subsidy to pay for what most citizens consider a luxury. Su…

In NL we have this subsidy for the rich.

Re: German government expands subsidies for electric cars

#29

Post by thinkcontext »

fluffything wrote: post #25
gibolt wrote: post #15

It is pretty blatant that they are increasing it by 50% to support Volkswagen's conversion to electric. Most of the other comments seem quite negative. It is protectionism, but it applies to most electric cars and is a step in the right direction. It is late and selfish, but better than the alternative.

Not only VW, any company can opt-in to the subsidies: the state pays half and the company the other half. What's funny is how the requirement of a <= 60k EUR car price means that those buying a Tesla won't get any subsidies. It's kind of understandable though: in Germany most cars are sold in the 10-20k EUR range, so it would be political suicide to create a subsidy to pay for what most citizens consider a luxury. Su…

Tesla Model 3 has a base price of 44.5K EUR.

https://cleantechnica.com/2019/04/13/tesla-model-3-vs-bmw-3-...

Re: German government expands subsidies for electric cars

#30

Post by radicalbyte »

the-dude wrote: post #28
fluffything wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not only VW, any company can opt-in to the subsidies: the state pays half and the company the other half. What's funny is how the requirement of a <= 60k EUR car price means that those buying a Tesla won't get any subsidies. It's kind of understandable though: in Germany most cars are sold in the 10-20k EUR range, so it would be political suicide to create a subsidy to pay for what most citizens consider a luxury. Su…

In NL we have this subsidy for the rich.

The people I see driving around in Tesla (or large Audi/Volvo) here aren't really rich, more have a decent job and a willingness to spend a substantial amount of money on a car.

I don't understand it personally, I prefer cycling and having my mortgage paid off but everyone to their own :)

I guess if you're in your 50s then you paid very little for your house so it makes sense to pay the 1200 EUR a month net for a car.

Post reply on HN