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U of Chicago projected to be the first U.S. university to cost $100k per year

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Re: U of Chicago projected to be the first U.S. university to cost $100k per year

#141

Post by Merrill »

OrangeMango wrote: post #120
Merrill wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

According to US News, University of Chicago is "Unranked in Best Engineering Schools". https://www.usnews.com/best-graduate-schools/top-engineering... The high school student needs to ask the question, "where is the best place to get a undergraduate degree in a specific field"? Generic rankings, especially ones that are heavily influenced by the university's research record, are pretty useless for undergraduate educa…

The University of Chicago doesn't have an engineering school, per say. They recently started a "School of Molecular Engineering" with a large donation from the governor of Illinois. But that is certainly not a general engineering school and isn't going to be, so it will never show up in these kind of ratings. > Our program was established as the Institute for Molecular Engineering in 2011 by the University in partner…

They do seem to have a decent CS grad school program. They are tied for 30th with 6 other universities in US News. https://www.usnews.com/best-graduate-schools/top-science-sch...

But Urbana-Champaign is 5th and should be somewhat less expensive.

Re: U of Chicago projected to be the first U.S. university to cost $100k per year

#142

Post by nkrisc »

bluetidepro wrote: post #14

Is University of Chicago even that good? Genuinely curious, as I know nothing about it. I live here in Chicago, and feel like I never hear about it, compared to say Northwestern or like UIC (University of Illinois at Chicago). Why would anyone ever pay that much for college yearly, if it wasn't like the #1 school, by a landslide, in the US? EDIT: I guess it is good? haha The more you know. Just surprising that I've b…

It was also the home of the first nuclear reactor:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chicago_Pile-1

Re: U of Chicago projected to be the first U.S. university to cost $100k per year

#143

Post by eindiran »

JDiculous wrote: post #15
sorenn111 wrote: post #7

One thing I find crazy is the very same institutions that are generally very left leaning, decry income inequality, and espouse generally liberal views then turn around and having tuition costs that having been rising at rates so far above inflation. Student debt is a major issue in the US and the ever increasing costs of tuition are a MAJOR culprit in pushing this crisis. Where are these costs coming from? How can y…

Has the University of Chicago ever advocated for free college? Their economics department, home of the late Milton Friedman and the Chicago Boys, is among the most right-leaning in the country.

This really isn't true anymore, but people keep regurgitating it. Chicago has a lot of behavioral economists like Thaler/List/Levitt, a lot of people who work on econometrics or mathematical economics like Harberger/Uhlig/Stokey/Tesler. There are still some Chicago school of economics folks at the university, but increasingly "the Chicago school" is an independent beast. There are a few emeritus professors in the old guard, but claiming that the department is one of the most "right-leaning" in the country is wrong.

Re: U of Chicago projected to be the first U.S. university to cost $100k per year

#144

Post by tallon »

slg wrote: post #55
chrischattin wrote: post #17

How to fix student loans... The .gov backs student loans. And, they are non-dischargeable. So, it is zero risk for the lender to give loan to the 2.7 GPA moron getting a worthless basket weaving degree from the local private lib arts school for $100k. So, they give as many loans as possible, since they can't lose (taxpayer on the hook). Colleges are incentivized to drive up costs of tuition b/c tons of free money. It…

This is fundamentally incompatible with the idea that everyone should be able to afford to go to college and private institutions need to foot the bill for the costs. We as a society prioritized availability of college education over costs. In order to get both you would likely have to change to some income percentage based repayment system instead of traditional loan repayments and that probably wouldn't be possible…

Half of all college students don't finish their 4-year degree in 5 years, and it's not due to cost. Even countries like France, Netherlands, etc which have lower costs for college, place you in a track when you're in your freshman year of high school. This track determines if you're going to college, a trade, or somewhere in between, and it's hard to switch from lower to higher tracks. College should not be a goal for 100% of the population like we have now, there should be a greater push for trades like chefs, electricians, HVAC technicians, plumbers, woodworking, metal working, glass blowing. You're an apprentice, you get paid a livable wage, and you have 0 student loans.

Re: U of Chicago projected to be the first U.S. university to cost $100k per year

#145

Post by chimi »

slg wrote: post #102
chimi wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Debt as an investment is fine. If you are investing in your future with your education, okay, but that requires the education be practical. It must have a value greater than its cost. That is not true for most education and thus we are not investing in our future as a society with this debt. I'd rather the debt we incur as a society be spent on infrastructure and engineers than wicker baskets. Wicker baskets don't la…

Sure, but once you bring financial value into the equation it starts limiting access. Not everyone can be an engineering major. Not everyone even belongs at college in the first place. But we as a society want everyone who wants to go to college to be able to afford it (at least initially). That is not compatible with a profit minded view of that education being a sound financial investment for each individual studen…

This doesn't mesh with my perspective of education. Universities are non-profits for a reason. yes, there are profit minded University of Phoenix's but that is not the historical norm and they are the worst offenders.

Not everyone should go to college. We shouldn't enable everyone to go to college. If you shouldn't go to college, going to college won't change that. You'll struggle and fail out or get a worthless degree because it's the only one you can pass enough classes to get.

We have trade schools. We have apprenticeships and on the job training. Lots of folks for home those paths are better, are turned off to them by social pressure, not logic. I've taken welding classes and vehicle maintenance classes and they have shown themselves to be valuable assets to me. I can connect steel at the atomic level. I can keep my vehicles safe for me and my family and friends.

There's no one-size-fits all approach to human evolution and we need all of us. Maybe I'm idealistic.

We need to stop doing stuff that only makes sense to the banks. They are entirely self-interested and provide negative value back to society. We are squandering our futures to the fat cats.

Re: U of Chicago projected to be the first U.S. university to cost $100k per year

#146

Post by eindiran »

sorenn111 wrote: post #7

One thing I find crazy is the very same institutions that are generally very left leaning, decry income inequality, and espouse generally liberal views then turn around and having tuition costs that having been rising at rates so far above inflation. Student debt is a major issue in the US and the ever increasing costs of tuition are a MAJOR culprit in pushing this crisis. Where are these costs coming from? How can y…

Given that most (yes, most) students at the University of Chicago receive financial aid, what you're seeing is a sticker price. The school is using the high sticker price + financial aid to perform very efficient price discrimination[0], so they can get a lot of money from people who can pay.

It is effectively a sliding scale fee [1].

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Price_discrimination

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sliding_scale_fees

Re: U of Chicago projected to be the first U.S. university to cost $100k per year

#147

Post by eindiran »

WhompingWindows wrote: post #77

UChicago 2011 graduate here. When I attended, I paid about $20k/year in tuition, given that I had various merit scholarships, worked for the university, and that my siblings also attended school. My parents were in for a RUDE awakening in my fourth year, however, when my brother graduated his undergraduate program...UChicago found out via a survey, that I was now the sole college attendee, and without warning they ja…

I'm a graduate of Uchicago (from shortly after you), and to offer a different perspective, I'm still paying off my loans (and will be for another 6 years), but I'm incredibly glad I went. I thought the undergraduate experience was perfect, and about half of my friends from around the world are people I met while I was there. I did get much worse marks that I had ever gotten before, but the University being very difficult is part of the package.

One question: I think a large part of the social experience for me was based around the house system. Even though I moved out of my house when I was a second-year, the house and dorm I was in provided a big chunk of my social network. Did you not have a good experience with your house? And if so, were you placed in the house you wanted to be in?

Re: U of Chicago projected to be the first U.S. university to cost $100k per year

#148

Post by misiti3780 »

threeisoneis wrote: post #110
misiti3780 wrote: post #71

As a US citizen, I see the US debt bomb ending it two different ways 1. Sanders/Warren get elected and somehow forgive 1.5 trillion in student loans and make education free going forward. 2. 2008 level crisis with (2) is the more probable I think universities tuition is way too expensive in our country, but I'm against (1) currently because I don't think retroactively forgiving debt is a good policy. The students too…

Do you believe the same thing about medical debt? Why or why not?

Yes, and no

Yes, because I dont want to live in a world or a country where someone can go bankrupt and/or end up in poverty because of medical problem - this is still possible in the US unfortunately (though I suspect vastly over stated), Regardless, I would never support forgiving of debts for elected/vanity surgeries.

No because I would not want to just forgive all medical debt without fixing the system, which currently seems impossible in the US, politically. Because of lobbying, big pharma, etc. , free heath care would just be too expensive to implement. Obama changed some things, Trump repealed some things. It's a political hot potato.

Fixing our system is like trying to turn the titanic at this point, and any changes we make alienate a large portion of the population.

Re: U of Chicago projected to be the first U.S. university to cost $100k per year

#149

Post by Finnucane »

moduspol wrote: post #107
Finnucane wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I work at one local university, and my wife works at another. One thing we've definitely noticed (and this is a widespread problem) is that the administration is becoming more top-heavy. There are cutbacks in faculty, support, and teaching staff, more reliance on adjuncts (academic temps, basically), and so on, while central administration grows. Expensive new buildings contribute, but less than people suppose. But t…

I worked for five years at a private university a few years ago, and my experience is similar, although to add a little: It never felt like a plan or conspiracy to make administration costs bigger. It's just very easy to do when you have more money coming in, year after year. In another economic environment, you'd get a "hard no" because the money isn't there. But when there is, expenditures become just another barga…

>But another big factor for those buildings is that we were getting loans for them, too, and those were based on (big surprise) long term forecasts presuming this gravy train is going to keep on chugging for the next 30+ years.

Harvard got spectacularly burned by the genius planning of Larry Summers in that regard.

Re: U of Chicago projected to be the first U.S. university to cost $100k per year

#150

Post by paulcole »

bluedevil2k wrote: post #78
paulcole wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If someone told me they'd give me $1 if I throw away a dime, why wouldn't I just keep taking their dollars all day long?

You don’t get a dollar (in your metaphor)...a student still requires variable costs so you’d be left with maybe a dime.

No. If the school assumes 10% of the risk of the loan, they still get the other 90% guaranteed.
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