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Lone Bitcoin Whale Likely Fueled 2017 Price Surge, Study Says

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Re: Lone Bitcoin Whale Likely Fueled 2017 Price Surge, Study Says

#101
post #2

The more I know about cryptos, the more I remain skeptical. The only people I know that uses cryptos seriously are acquaintancies from latin america, and none of them for storing value, with the exception of Venezuelans. Not even argentinians, that just buy as many dollars they can. IMO this is a thread worth reading on this topic: https://www.reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/dj2jro/the_large...

soon in a Starbucks near you though. Look it up..bakkt

This, also, is a scam.

Re: Lone Bitcoin Whale Likely Fueled 2017 Price Surge, Study Says

#102
post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And how is it pegged? Someone asked the various exchanges very nicely if they could only trade it for $1?

Dai is explained here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GnoQOlVTMeg

The only way to find out is to watch a 20 minute video by a crypto nutter? Is there not a simple explanation for how Dai is pegged to the dollar?

Re: Lone Bitcoin Whale Likely Fueled 2017 Price Surge, Study Says

#103
post #24

Clickbait title. The subtitle is probably more accurate: "The series of $1,000 days that brought BTC to a record above $19,600 could have been the work of one entity" I'm very skeptical. It is certainly possible that a single entity may have encouraged the rally. But there is no way that a single entity actually moved the markets this much. The amount of cash required would be significant. During this time, there wer…

You're implying a single exchange moving the market needs cash to move it. If the ecosystem has decided one exchange is the lead price, then they manipulate the price without needing the underlying assets. Furthermore, bitcoin is one of the only markets I've seen which rewards "whales" instead of punishing them, because in most markets moving the market you will lose money to slippage. The market price will retract a…

>If the ecosystem has decided one exchange is the lead price, then they manipulate the price without needing the underlying assets.

Okay, but I think there's a big difference between:

A) Some whale committed bottomless resources to keep bidding up an asset whenever it fell in price, leading to a much higher price over six months, vs

B) Some whale caused a one-day surge in price of the asset, which got the asset attention, which had numerous cascading effects over the next six months, including greater attention for the asset, which led to a bigger, deeper reserve of demand for it.

It feels like a stretch to refer to B) as "one whale causing the entire rally", as there is a more complex network of effects at play.

Re: Lone Bitcoin Whale Likely Fueled 2017 Price Surge, Study Says

#104
post #63
post #51

Cryptocurrency is just penny stocks (before regulation). Same pump-and-dump manipulation occurs. Why is this surprising?

What about the flash crash of stock market by a single individual? https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2010_Flash_Crash

Yes, what about it?

Re: Lone Bitcoin Whale Likely Fueled 2017 Price Surge, Study Says

#105
post #51

Cryptocurrency is just penny stocks (before regulation). Same pump-and-dump manipulation occurs. Why is this surprising?

Bitcoin would be the ~20th largest company in the S&P by market cap. Hardly a penny stock.

Bitcoin's "market cap" is completely imaginary.

Re: Lone Bitcoin Whale Likely Fueled 2017 Price Surge, Study Says

#106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Similarly, I try to add it to all my side-projects that accept payment. I looked at a few payment providers and settled on OpenNode, as they had the right mix of an easy API, quick support and good documentation, though I would like it if they supported more cryptocurrencies. If you want cryptocurrencies to succeed, you need to make them widespread as a form of payment. I already lament Steam and Stripe removing Bitc…

Unfortunately, Bitcoin as designed is technically incapable of being in widespread use for payment, due to a severe lack of network capacity, and a complete lack of interest in ever changing this. Instead, all effort is going into a building a flawed second layer that is theoretically unsound and a usability nightmare.

The idea here is that the blockchain model where everyone checks everything that happens doesn't scale to billions of users.

Fortunately for people who disagree, there are hundreds of crypto projects that think this is possible. Including straight up copies of Bitcoin like Bitcoin Cash and Bitcoin SV.

Re: Lone Bitcoin Whale Likely Fueled 2017 Price Surge, Study Says

#107
post #51

Cryptocurrency is just penny stocks (before regulation). Same pump-and-dump manipulation occurs. Why is this surprising?

Bitcoin would be the ~20th largest company in the S&P by market cap. Hardly a penny stock.

Market cap is an absurd metric for cryptocurrencies. If print a billion tokens and sell you one for a dollar, it’s a billion dollar market cap.

Re: Lone Bitcoin Whale Likely Fueled 2017 Price Surge, Study Says

#108
post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> He could have sent it 'traditionally' but he would have been harassed about why he was sending money abroad and wasted considerable time and effort going to a physical bank branch. Instead in under a minute he sent me some Ethereum and we both were able to confirm the transaction near immediately Have you heard of options like TransferWise or OFX? They offer immediate transfers, lower transaction fees than ETH or B…

>Earning interest He's talking about "DeFi" ("distributed finance") - the current craze in the Ethereum world. Various groups are offering significant interest rates for loaning out your Eth. It's hard to see how it's not another speculation bubble waiting to burst.

I suppose calling this “Probabilistic Online-Zone Investment” aka “POnZI” would have been a bit on the nose.

Re: Lone Bitcoin Whale Likely Fueled 2017 Price Surge, Study Says

#109
post #2

The more I know about cryptos, the more I remain skeptical. The only people I know that uses cryptos seriously are acquaintancies from latin america, and none of them for storing value, with the exception of Venezuelans. Not even argentinians, that just buy as many dollars they can. IMO this is a thread worth reading on this topic: https://www.reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/dj2jro/the_large...

There is plenty of future potential for crypto currencies. However, there are a few yet to be addressed technical problems with the current blockchains that make them unsuitable for anything but speculative investment and very light/experimental usage (i.e. only a handful of transactions per meaningful timeunit).

The main technical challenges have to do with scaling issues. Facebook's recent proposal for Libra is interesting in the sense that it proposes some workable solutions for these. If you ignore the permissive vs. permission-less fundamentalism by some in this space as well as the political controversy, they actually did a fine job technically moving things forward with a better contract language than solidity and a loosely permissive and potentially long term permissionless system not unlike Ripple and Stellar.

Also, Ethereum is on a slow path to sharding and proof of stake. Sadly, that means it's currently unusuable for anything that requires scaling numbers of transactions/users. That in turn means most of what is currently running on it is a bad joke in terms of scalability. Most of the serious things associated with it happen on so-called side chains. This is just a fancy name for a convoluted and centralized database. Also it means anything building on the current version is going to face repeated disruptive forks in the network. That makes anything depending on Ethereum a proof of concept at best. That's the vast majority of (at this point mostly failed) ICOs on this platform.

IMHO a few things will happen in the next few years.

1) several of the currently well funded startups will start producing working products with actual users and revenue (the non speculative variety). Given the level of funding these companies received they would have a long runway for getting there and no rush to hit the market until several years from now earliest. In terms of tech startups, this would actually be relatively fast.

2) Most of the early startups in this space will fail. I expect a dotcom style consolidation phase where all of the BS, scams, etc. will fade away or be abandoned. This will take some time and be chaotic and generate a lot of negative news.

3) Several fin tech companies and banks are already integrating blockchains into their technology stack and the transaction volume depending on this will hit an exponential growth curve a few years from now. Most of this stuff is operating under the radar currently but are doing the right things from a technical point of view to make this scale. These will be mostly using permissive blockchains based on Ripple, Stellar, Libra, or similar.

4) Central banks outside the US and EU may start using blockchains because it makes sense. E.g. China has some plans here and and has an obvious opportunity to establish themselves as the digital currency of choice in most of South America, Asia, and Africa (basically anywhere with a weak, inflation challenged currency, and a lack of widely used banking products). Libra was after this opportunity as well.

5) Most of the utopian stuff in this space is IMHO doomed because it doesn't solve a problem people have other than fulfilling some political/idealistic agenda. That means I expect most of the financial success to be in permissive rather than permission-less systems. Legislators are pretty much going to require this for anything serious and most institutions with access to money are not going to want to come anywhere near the scams, criminals, and money launderers currently trading bitcoin. Bitcoin as such may survive as a convoluted alternative to owning gold (which is it's only use today).

6) The US and EU will take their sweet time adjusting their legislation. Short term we can expect nothing more than platitudes from ignorant politicians and very little in terms of any coherent/meaningful new laws in this space. The status quo is that most of the parliament members across nations lack the knowledge to have a coherent point of view. IMHO china is going lead by example here because they don't have this problem and have a clear incentive/goal. Then the west will catch up, eventually.

Re: Lone Bitcoin Whale Likely Fueled 2017 Price Surge, Study Says

#110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

With current Bitcoin volatility it's crazy to store money with it. I really love tech which allows me to remember passphrase and having all money locked inside my brain, so I would certainly use it if it weren't so volatile.

I always get downvoted for asking this but... doesn’t that seem like a really bad idea that makes you far far more vulnerable to physical crime? If a guy mugs you at an atm, the bank is going to flag something as suspicious. If a guy mugs you for your private key, you have no recourse for all of your holdings- and the getaway is a lot easier. Physical crypto crime feels like it would be very prevalent if it became “m…

The idea of Bitcoin is a system without any centralized trust, eg. "what do you do if the bank mugs you" would be a counter argument.

Some people used to think/want that Bitcoin was going to take over all other forms of money. I don't think many people still believe that. In that sense it's just like other forms of property that can be stolen.

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