Gitlab considers not hiring SREs and Support Engineers in China and Russia • Hacker News Board

Re: Gitlab considers not hiring SREs and Support Engineers in China and Russia

#331

Post by munmaek » Mon, Nov 04, 2019, 12:14 PM UTC

pbhjpbhj wrote: post #207

mschuster91 wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Are you in USA? Should other countries refuse to employ USA citizens because of actions of the government - things like pulling out of Syria to enable the Turkish murder of the Kurds to continue. >China has been using our money ... The best way is to vote with your money then?

Well, the US government wont make my family disappear if I don’t cooperate, for starters.

I find it intellectually dishonest to compare the USA’s foreign policy with a dictatorship government that forces compliance through threats on local relatives, etc.

Re: Gitlab considers not hiring SREs and Support Engineers in China and Russia

#332

Post by type0 » Mon, Nov 04, 2019, 12:14 PM UTC

jai_ wrote: post #311

netok wrote: post #288

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a chinese, this kind of comment makes me hate the west even more. I have no control over my government. Zero. 0. Do you understand the concept of 0? Thats the amount of influence I have over any government matter. And you people being racist pos because there is nothing I can do about my gov. Wtf do you want?

Why do you feel that Chinese citizens as a whole have no influence of the actions of their government?

Feel what!? You need to look up how the structure of the citizen control by the party functions out there, even if you wanted there's no wiggle room for that.

Re: Gitlab considers not hiring SREs and Support Engineers in China and Russia

#333

Post by _iyig » Mon, Nov 04, 2019, 12:20 PM UTC

netok wrote: post #288

mb_72 wrote: post #242

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Curious as the way I see it it's very often China who is the 'initiator', eg internment of Muslims, stealing of territory in South China sea, debt-trap diplomacy, and so forth. Presuming that you are aware of these occurrences, do you agree with your government's positions and actions, and - if not - what actions, if any, do you take to make it clear your opposition? The Chinese government is, IMO, massively over sen…

As a chinese, this kind of comment makes me hate the west even more. I have no control over my government. Zero. 0. Do you understand the concept of 0? Thats the amount of influence I have over any government matter. And you people being racist pos because there is nothing I can do about my gov. Wtf do you want?

>And you people being racist pos

In what way was the parent comment racist?

Re: Gitlab considers not hiring SREs and Support Engineers in China and Russia

#334

Post by skissane » Mon, Nov 04, 2019, 12:20 PM UTC

sjy wrote: post #256

skissane wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Constitutionally speaking, the President does not require a security clearance; the President ex officio has unlimited access to classified information. If there are concerns the President may be vulnerable to foreign influence, the constitutional processes to address those concerns are election and impeachment not security clearances.

Is it a constitutional principle that no secrets may be kept from the President? Or is it just that the “security clearance” system is currently based on executive orders that the President issues, rather than Congress exercising its power to “make Rules for the Government and Regulation of the land and naval forces"?

According to the Congressional Research Service, "By virtue of his constitutional role as commander-and-in-chief and head of the executive branch, the President has access to all national intelligence collected, analyzed and produced by the Intelligence Community"

Source: https://web.archive.org/web/20110113190609/http://feinstein....

I think if Congress tried to pass a law limiting the President's access to classified information, the Supreme Court would likely find it to be unconstitutional.

Re: Gitlab considers not hiring SREs and Support Engineers in China and Russia

#335

Post by imglorp » Mon, Nov 04, 2019, 12:21 PM UTC

_wmhc wrote: post #324

computerex wrote: post #318

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nationalism has always been high in China ever since the CCP took control. Not being a nationalist would be a good way to suddenly disappear off the face of the Earth. China has always had double standards. They make it hell for U.S companies to do business there. The only thing that has changed is that the U.S has started pushing back somewhat as of late, but things are still currently in favor of China. When China…

>realize that personal liberties, sovereignty and privacy are important to the "west" I think that Snowden showed us that this is not actually true. Things like National Security letters and the PATRIOT act make the US to me, as a European, seem very hypocritical right now.

Yes, but I think the difference is that CCP is much further down the abuse road than Western governments.

First, they've had neighbor surveilling (snitching on) neighbor to control the people since Mao: it's part of the culture and fully accepted because they can't envision another way. They have a saying [ref needed] "Such a people deserve such a government." Now of course the whole tech stack supports it. We're just getting used to ubiquitous domestic surveillance in the West.

Second, because they've further along, they've used their control of information to abuse their power. Tibet, Tiananmen, organ harvesting, and more lately the Uighur atrocities against people of dissent or race. The West is not there but you can see we're blasting down that road now.

Re: Gitlab considers not hiring SREs and Support Engineers in China and Russia

#336

Post by mb_72 » Mon, Nov 04, 2019, 12:21 PM UTC

netok wrote: post #288

mb_72 wrote: post #242

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Curious as the way I see it it's very often China who is the 'initiator', eg internment of Muslims, stealing of territory in South China sea, debt-trap diplomacy, and so forth. Presuming that you are aware of these occurrences, do you agree with your government's positions and actions, and - if not - what actions, if any, do you take to make it clear your opposition? The Chinese government is, IMO, massively over sen…

As a chinese, this kind of comment makes me hate the west even more. I have no control over my government. Zero. 0. Do you understand the concept of 0? Thats the amount of influence I have over any government matter. And you people being racist pos because there is nothing I can do about my gov. Wtf do you want?

> As a chinese, this kind of comment makes me hate the west even more. I have no control over my government.

That right there is exactly the response your government would want you to have. You already 'hate the west', and now even more because of what I wrote? That seems unreasonable to me, and there was not one racist mention in my comment either.

If 'my' government (in Australia) were pulling these kind of stunts in 'my' name, damn right I would be doing something about it. In fact, I already do something about my community's shabby treatment of the First Australians (financially and lobbying wise).

I feel we, the people, have a responsibility to ourselves and other humans, irrespective of country of origin, culture or background, to resist and oppose transgressions by the governments who represent us.

Re: Gitlab considers not hiring SREs and Support Engineers in China and Russia

#337

Post by anoncake » Mon, Nov 04, 2019, 12:21 PM UTC

netok wrote: post #288

mb_72 wrote: post #242

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Curious as the way I see it it's very often China who is the 'initiator', eg internment of Muslims, stealing of territory in South China sea, debt-trap diplomacy, and so forth. Presuming that you are aware of these occurrences, do you agree with your government's positions and actions, and - if not - what actions, if any, do you take to make it clear your opposition? The Chinese government is, IMO, massively over sen…

As a chinese, this kind of comment makes me hate the west even more. I have no control over my government. Zero. 0. Do you understand the concept of 0? Thats the amount of influence I have over any government matter. And you people being racist pos because there is nothing I can do about my gov. Wtf do you want?

It's only zero if you exclude actions that are unlikely to work while requiring great sacrifices and/or likely to get you killed. Of course, no one should blame you for not:

- Joining/founding an underground resistance group

- Distributing anti-government propaganda

- Rising through the ranks of the party until you're influential.

- Emigrating (This won't directly influence your government. But losing skilled workers (I assume you are one) harms the economy, making a revolution more likely.

- If that is not possible, being as unproductive as you can get away with.

- Becoming friends with high-ranking officials, then influence them.

- Protesting. You can technically make sure you won't get punished by setting yourself on fire.

> And you people being racist pos because there is nothing I can do about my gov. Wtf do you want?

No one's being racist here. The entity people don't trust is the Chinese government. Governments act through the people they govern so that distrust extends to your potentially involuntary actions (but not to your character). Note that Gitlab doesn't trust employees living in China independently of their ethnicity.

Re: Gitlab considers not hiring SREs and Support Engineers in China and Russia

#338

Post by Nasrudith » Mon, Nov 04, 2019, 12:25 PM UTC

benologist wrote: post #12

Probably an idea to throw Australia on that list - https://www.zdnet.com/article/whats-actually-in-australias-e...

Yeah I would assume most only don't have them on the list because they weren't actually dealing with them in the first place and had no expectation to have a use for them.

Re: Gitlab considers not hiring SREs and Support Engineers in China and Russia

#339

Post by mb_72 » Mon, Nov 04, 2019, 12:25 PM UTC

arczyx wrote: post #291

mb_72 wrote: post #242

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Curious as the way I see it it's very often China who is the 'initiator', eg internment of Muslims, stealing of territory in South China sea, debt-trap diplomacy, and so forth. Presuming that you are aware of these occurrences, do you agree with your government's positions and actions, and - if not - what actions, if any, do you take to make it clear your opposition? The Chinese government is, IMO, massively over sen…

>Presuming that you are aware of these occurrences, do you agree with your government's positions and actions, and - if not - what actions, if any, do you take to make it clear your opposition? I'm not from China and I disagree with the action of the China's government you listed above. However I wonder why this kind of opinion (aka the Chinese should be responsible for their government) is not commonly held against…

Well, I at least try to be consistent, and do query my USA friends about the current administration and it's actions. Recent political changes in the USA have made it the norm to have similar populist leaders or parties gain strength all around the world, it's actually quite distressing for me to see.

Re: Gitlab considers not hiring SREs and Support Engineers in China and Russia

#340

Post by munmaek » Mon, Nov 04, 2019, 12:25 PM UTC

seanmcdirmid wrote: post #145

kyboren wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> By that reasoning, a presidential candidate of Chinese descent who was a natural born American citizen but had relatives back in china would be disqualified Not so. The Constitution is very clear on eligibility requirements for the President. A natural born American citizen of Chinese descent who otherwise satisfies the requirements in Article II, Section 1, Clause 5 is perfectly eligible to run for the office. If…

> Second, I am curious why you disagree completely, yet accept that your relationship with your wife may disqualify you from holding a government security clearance. This has to do with companies making their own rules about what is right or wrong without any checks, balances, or voter feedback. Security clearances are actually defined by law, I’m against corporations becoming their own extra judicial entities.

As long as companies are operating faithfully within the law, they’re free to do that. And you’re free to criticize it and boycott it.

Companies like Apple and others should be allowed to be concerned about theft of sensitive data just as much as the government. Just because it’s not a matter of national security doesn’t mean it’s okay.

Nobody here is trying to discriminate against a race. The problem is having ties to relatives living under a government that is known for making people disappear. The same would apply for a white person with many relatives there, etc.

Your argument of companies not being allowed to take cautionary steps against a foreign government doesn’t hold water.