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A CS degree is better than teaching yourself how to code?

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Re: A CS degree is better than teaching yourself how to code?

#241
post #225
post #222

I work with a team of people who mostly have "Software Engineering" degrees. I am one of the few with CS. In short: IN GENERAL - Those with SE degrees (or other non-CS degree, or no degree) can be excellent developers (good code style, good unit test coverage, aggressive PR reviewers, etc). However, the art of computer programming - or computer system design -- is often in formally defining the problem at hand using…

nitpicking here but aggressive PR reviewers != excellent developers

I suspect they mean someone who is aggressive in terms of their initiative, not their communication style.

Re: A CS degree is better than teaching yourself how to code?

#242
post #225

Earlier quoted context omitted.

nitpicking here but aggressive PR reviewers != excellent developers

What is an aggressive PR reviewer? Uses a lot of swear words?

Hah. Nah, I meant someone who is extremely thorough and catches many thing proactively that would otherwise be bugs that are difficult to track down.

Re: A CS degree is better than teaching yourself how to code?

#243
Something missed in the article and most of the comments is the degree (or certification) provides a broad roadmap of, at least in theory, the entire topic.

I spent several years doing BGP and related router support; when I passed my CCNP I was forced to learn a lot of interesting broad topics ranging from multicasting to obscure details of low level packet switching.

When I was very young in the 80s and introduced to 1st edition K+R C I was unimpressed with pointers; why bother with all this? Later, I found pointers pretty interesting and useful for data structures and low level driver "stuff".

This is hardly a problem solely for CS. Philosophy has the same issue. Self taught philosopher almost certainly means maybe one favorite author and maybe one book named something like "The philosophy of (insert pop culture movie title here)" and little more. Even a pretty lame intro to philosophy class will be much more broad.

An enforced broad education of a topic can be very useful. That seems to generally be missing in online education. A lot of effort over the years has been put into very tiny topics like "how to teach kids the derivative of x to the y power" but very little effort seems to be put into "how to decide what is learning enough of calculus, how to measure it, and how to pinpoint lacking areas"

Re: A CS degree is better than teaching yourself how to code?

#244
As a bootcamp instructor:

1. I gave deadlines

2. Students did group assignments 50% of the time

3. They learned to work with Git and how to communicate

I studied a CS degree and learned less collaboration than my students did.

Based on my experience I must conclude with regret that this article is too unnuanced and therefore not very informing, if at all.

The author himself can email me for a discussion on mettamage@protonmail.com since I'd like to understand his views better and perhaps he might benefit from mine.

Edit: I emailed the author.

Re: A CS degree is better than teaching yourself how to code?

#245
post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I know what is happening at a network layer, OS layer, memory layer, application layer, and system layer, and code layer. Yep. For me, the biggest reason I think a degree is necessary is because it is comprehensive. Self taught people are going to inevitably have multiple holes in their understanding. And worst of all, they will be ignorant of where those holes lie and how large they are.

> > I know what is happening at a network layer, OS layer, memory layer, application layer, and system layer, and code layer. > Yep. For me, the biggest reason I think a degree is necessary is because it is comprehensive. Self taught people are going to inevitably have multiple holes in their understanding. And worst of all, they will be ignorant of where those holes lie and how large they are. This is not my experie…

Yes - I do. ;) However, it may be because it is my passion and work.

Re: A CS degree is better than teaching yourself how to code?

#246
post #222

I work with a team of people who mostly have "Software Engineering" degrees. I am one of the few with CS. In short: IN GENERAL - Those with SE degrees (or other non-CS degree, or no degree) can be excellent developers (good code style, good unit test coverage, aggressive PR reviewers, etc). However, the art of computer programming - or computer system design -- is often in formally defining the problem at hand using…

I have to be honest with you, I find your experience to be contrary to mine. I went to university to get a degree in Computer Science, but I dropped out because the course work was full of stuff that did not have anything to do with computer science. Furthermore, you will find that in many countries, a Computer Science degree is the same as a Software Engineering degree. I have met many computer science majors who ar…

I have a CS degree and my university also provided a SE degree. The first years, we all studied together. Only in the final year did we study courses that deviated (some were still shared). The final year was about focusing on either the science or the engineering disciples. I felt like it worked really well. The SE's left with a really good knowledge of computational science, while also learning how to engineer solutions. The CS students got some experience in engineering, without it being the main focus.

Re: A CS degree is better than teaching yourself how to code?

#247
post #222

I work with a team of people who mostly have "Software Engineering" degrees. I am one of the few with CS. In short: IN GENERAL - Those with SE degrees (or other non-CS degree, or no degree) can be excellent developers (good code style, good unit test coverage, aggressive PR reviewers, etc). However, the art of computer programming - or computer system design -- is often in formally defining the problem at hand using…

I have to be honest with you, I find your experience to be contrary to mine. I went to university to get a degree in Computer Science, but I dropped out because the course work was full of stuff that did not have anything to do with computer science. Furthermore, you will find that in many countries, a Computer Science degree is the same as a Software Engineering degree. I have met many computer science majors who ar…

I have the sake experience of you. I started working when I was 19 and started at 21(at night) a computer science. I left the course at the 4th year because I felt that I wasn't learning anything.

Re: A CS degree is better than teaching yourself how to code?

#248
Why do people define CS as coding? Computer Science is much more than just coding, it’s a science. At a higher level CS involves a lot of mathematics and statistics. Coding is just a tool for a computer scientist as a hammer is a tool for a builder. Learning to use a hammer is not the same as learning to build a house.

Re: A CS degree is better than teaching yourself how to code?

#249
post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is the only correct answer. So many times these questions are posed as a false dichotomy. The simple answer is: why not both? That being said, personally I thought for a long time that I didn't need to study CS and could teach myself to code (which is true), however I do notice that sometimes I lack a deep fundamental understanding of CS, which I regret.

Check out The Imposter’s Handbook by Rob Conery.

Thanks, seems like a good tip. Will definitely read it!

Re: A CS degree is better than teaching yourself how to code?

#250
post #222

I work with a team of people who mostly have "Software Engineering" degrees. I am one of the few with CS. In short: IN GENERAL - Those with SE degrees (or other non-CS degree, or no degree) can be excellent developers (good code style, good unit test coverage, aggressive PR reviewers, etc). However, the art of computer programming - or computer system design -- is often in formally defining the problem at hand using…

What’s the difference between SE and CS? At some schools with “computer engineering” that covers EE material related to Computers (circuits, CPU design, etc) as well as CS.
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