A CS degree is better than teaching yourself how to code? • Hacker News Board

Re: A CS degree is better than teaching yourself how to code?

#231

Post by gamesbrainiac » Sun, Nov 03, 2019, 1:49 PM UTC

Jedi72 wrote: post #152

The lack of appreciation of pure knowledge in this thread is truly saddening. If all you care about is getting a job, this question boils down to simple finance. If you want to truly learn, understand and engage in a topic, what can possibly be better than emmersing oneself in an environment of learning, inquisitive students and knowledgable professors full-time?

I think you need to learn to appreciate that universities don't have a monopoly on pure knowledge. You can learn a lot on your own if you have the time and patience.

Furthermore, with new online courses you can learn more advanced topics in a far easier manner than every before.

Re: A CS degree is better than teaching yourself how to code?

#232

Post by [deleted] » Sun, Nov 03, 2019, 1:52 PM UTC

bachmeier wrote: post #215

matwood wrote: post #196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Teaching yourself to code while getting a CS degree is best IMO. This is effectively what I did. I found a job at a small company programming part time while I was still in school. Class was very much this is how things should work, and the job was this is how things actually work when you're coding for clients with unrealistic schedules just trying to make rent. I learned a lot in both scenarios. The other thing I…

> the job was this is how things actually work when you're coding for clients with unrealistic schedules just trying to make rent This description comes with an important disclaimer. You learned how things worked at a particular company and for the one or more projects that you were assigned. There's no reason to think any of the knowledge you pick up in a specific job will be valued outside the company, or even in a…

[deleted]

Re: A CS degree is better than teaching yourself how to code?

#233

Post by vbtemp » Sun, Nov 03, 2019, 1:52 PM UTC

gamesbrainiac wrote: post #230

vbtemp wrote: post #222

I work with a team of people who mostly have "Software Engineering" degrees. I am one of the few with CS. In short: IN GENERAL - Those with SE degrees (or other non-CS degree, or no degree) can be excellent developers (good code style, good unit test coverage, aggressive PR reviewers, etc). However, the art of computer programming - or computer system design -- is often in formally defining the problem at hand using…

I have to be honest with you, I find your experience to be contrary to mine. I went to university to get a degree in Computer Science, but I dropped out because the course work was full of stuff that did not have anything to do with computer science. Furthermore, you will find that in many countries, a Computer Science degree is the same as a Software Engineering degree. I have met many computer science majors who ar…

You're right. At the end of the day it's just that special mix of experience (professional and academic), natural talent, interest, and professionalism.

Re: A CS degree is better than teaching yourself how to code?

#234

Post by buckminster » Sun, Nov 03, 2019, 1:52 PM UTC

monk_e_boy wrote: post #144

EliRivers wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While I didn't do a CS degree, from what I could tell of friends who were doing that, it was a course in mathematical logic and algorithms built with that logic, and analysis of problems in such a way that they could be explored and solved using the logic, with some modules demonstrating applications of that mathematical logic such as operating systems and compilers, which were helpful tools created out of the logic…

The degree covers a lot of ground. Different languages, AI, robotics, people management, teams, etc etc Mostly it informs the student of their current level of understanding. 70% of lecturing is marking assignments. That’s what you don’t get when you teach yourself.

Which CS degree? They vary enormously.

Re: A CS degree is better than teaching yourself how to code?

#235

Post by gamesbrainiac » Sun, Nov 03, 2019, 1:53 PM UTC

gerbilly wrote: post #212

Almost all the work done in industry is O(1) programming. It's difficult work, but not complex. I'm not surprised every thread started by a person who hires grads undervalues their education, because they probably don't have any work to assign to them that contains any complexity. This doesn't say much for us as an industry. The simple and avoidable difficulties of 'real world' programming are not much to brag about.…

I think the pace of change has something to do with the quality of documentation. We are writing more software to do more things, and by the time we are done, we want it to do even more.

This is why we are in the mess that we are in right now.

Re: A CS degree is better than teaching yourself how to code?

#236

Post by nycdotnet » Sun, Nov 03, 2019, 1:56 PM UTC

mmcnl wrote: post #156

greggman2 wrote: post #105

Teaching yourself to code while getting a CS degree is best IMO. Just teaching yourself you'll likely miss lots of topics and not challenge yourself as much. Conversely I've met plenty of students that don't really care about the topic and are just taking the class to get a job. So do both! Take the class and teach yourself. In other words pursue your hobbies and use code where those hobbies match. Learn the things y…

This is the only correct answer. So many times these questions are posed as a false dichotomy. The simple answer is: why not both? That being said, personally I thought for a long time that I didn't need to study CS and could teach myself to code (which is true), however I do notice that sometimes I lack a deep fundamental understanding of CS, which I regret.

Check out The Imposter’s Handbook by Rob Conery.

Re: A CS degree is better than teaching yourself how to code?

#237

Post by Dumblydorr » Sun, Nov 03, 2019, 1:56 PM UTC

Jedi72 wrote: post #152

The lack of appreciation of pure knowledge in this thread is truly saddening. If all you care about is getting a job, this question boils down to simple finance. If you want to truly learn, understand and engage in a topic, what can possibly be better than emmersing oneself in an environment of learning, inquisitive students and knowledgable professors full-time?

My professors didn't distill pure knowledge nearly as distinctly as did my drive to deliver for real clients.

Re: A CS degree is better than teaching yourself how to code?

#238

Post by kyberias » Sun, Nov 03, 2019, 1:57 PM UTC

fargo wrote: post #225

vbtemp wrote: post #222

I work with a team of people who mostly have "Software Engineering" degrees. I am one of the few with CS. In short: IN GENERAL - Those with SE degrees (or other non-CS degree, or no degree) can be excellent developers (good code style, good unit test coverage, aggressive PR reviewers, etc). However, the art of computer programming - or computer system design -- is often in formally defining the problem at hand using…

nitpicking here but aggressive PR reviewers != excellent developers

What is an aggressive PR reviewer? Uses a lot of swear words?

Re: A CS degree is better than teaching yourself how to code?

#239

Post by buckminster » Sun, Nov 03, 2019, 1:57 PM UTC

greggman2 wrote: post #105

Teaching yourself to code while getting a CS degree is best IMO. Just teaching yourself you'll likely miss lots of topics and not challenge yourself as much. Conversely I've met plenty of students that don't really care about the topic and are just taking the class to get a job. So do both! Take the class and teach yourself. In other words pursue your hobbies and use code where those hobbies match. Learn the things y…

Why wait for university? Teach yourself to code before you do the CS degree. I've always found it easier to understand the theory when I already understand the practice.

Re: A CS degree is better than teaching yourself how to code?

#240

Post by kbsletten » Sun, Nov 03, 2019, 2:00 PM UTC

BonesJustice wrote: post #182

greggman2 wrote: post #105

Teaching yourself to code while getting a CS degree is best IMO. Just teaching yourself you'll likely miss lots of topics and not challenge yourself as much. Conversely I've met plenty of students that don't really care about the topic and are just taking the class to get a job. So do both! Take the class and teach yourself. In other words pursue your hobbies and use code where those hobbies match. Learn the things y…

If I were asked to impart one piece of advice to prospective CS students, it would be to take advantage of your school’s coop work program or, if there isn’t one, to try and find a recurring internship. Nothing beats real world experience, and the sooner you can put theory into practice, the better. Additional learning on your own is, of course, also a great idea. Pick a project you’d like to do, and then do it. Or f…

I was astounded how much better I was than my classmates at coding, testing, debugging, etc. I attribute all of it to the 25 hours a week I spent at work.