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GitHub tries to quell employee anger over its ICE contract

latimes.com

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Re: GitHub tries to quell employee anger over its ICE contract

#181

Post by shadowgovt »

refurb wrote: post #172
standardUser wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because if you haven't noticed, there is a general sense among the younger generations that the many, many ills of yesteryear are actually bad, not just "business as usual" and instead of tolerating them we should start to fight back. The people who are carrying the torch of this mentality were teenagers and twenty-something during the Obama administration. Now they are all grown ups. The better question is, why were…

Oh BS. It’s clearly apparent over the last few election cycles that if your side does something, “it’s unfortunate, but we’re trying to fix it” and if the other side does something “they are horrible people who are monsters”. It comes down to nothing more than scoring political points.

I'm curious what side you perceive standardUser to be on. They are making the case that this wasn't acceptable under the Obama administration either to younger generations, but they lacked the political power and voice to do anything about it. Voice and political power that they are now finding as they age into voting enfranchisement and build political action blocs.

Re: GitHub tries to quell employee anger over its ICE contract

#182

Post by codyb »

BurningFrog wrote: post #168

If anyone thinks Github boycotting ICE will change anything of ICE's conduct, that to me is some kind of Delusions of Grandeur. The money involved are a tiny part of a forgotten section of their budget. If they don't think it will change anything, we can agree that this boycott is purely symbolic and will accomplish nothing.

This feels like a pretty defeatist attitude to me. Just because your portion of ICE’s budget is insignificant doesn’t mean you have to support ICE.

And even if it is purely symbolic, lots of symbolic actions do more than nothing.

At the very least it may improve employee morale to not support ICE which may increase Github’s employee retention rate, which may not be a big deal for ICE but may be a bigger deal for Github.

And finally, death by a thousand cuts is certainly a thing.

Re: GitHub tries to quell employee anger over its ICE contract

#183

Post by noelsusman »

ratsmack wrote: post #2

It seems that these kinds of demands are becoming more common. Is it because conflict resolution is becoming a dying art, is it because people don't rise to the level of maturity of past times? I just find it to be confusing. Non PW link: https://archive.ph/IkYQ3

One man's maturity of past times is another man's unwillingness to confront injustice in society.

But on a broader note, I think a lot of it can be traced to the current president. He seems to go out of his way to do things that stir up deep anger in his opponents. There's a reason why millions of people hit the streets the day after his inauguration to register their dissatisfaction with the fact that he's president. That was unprecedented in US history.

Combine that with how little an average person can do to influence what happens in Washington, and you get a whole lot of angry people desperate for something they can actually impact. Tech employees have leverage over their employers, and they're using it for this because it's the only avenue they have to vent their anger at the current state of politics. The candidate they probably supported in 2016 got more votes but lost anyway. They probably don't live in a state that's competitive in the electoral college. Their local representatives probably represent their views well but are similarly limited in how much impact they can have. This is one of the only ways they can actually do something about what's making them angry, and they're taking advantage of it.

I'm surprised it's not happening at more companies.

Re: GitHub tries to quell employee anger over its ICE contract

#184

Post by jacquesm »

BurningFrog wrote: post #168

If anyone thinks Github boycotting ICE will change anything of ICE's conduct, that to me is some kind of Delusions of Grandeur. The money involved are a tiny part of a forgotten section of their budget. If they don't think it will change anything, we can agree that this boycott is purely symbolic and will accomplish nothing.

Username checks out. No, but you really don't want to be a collaborator either. If other parties are willing to step up then they can be addressed if and when that time comes. Principles always were a 'circle of influence' thing.

Re: GitHub tries to quell employee anger over its ICE contract

#185

Post by killface »

standardUser wrote: post #155
jacobsenscott wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it is because human rights abuses by the US government are becoming more common. Or at least more brazen.

I don't think there is evidence to back that up, especially once you dig in to the actions of the federal government in the 60's, 70's and 80's. But people, mostly young people, are clearly more vocal about pushing back when abuses come to light.

I think also in the age of internet, cell phones, constant surveillance, and more, we're also much more aware of these atrocities and the governments do not always have the power to simply hide it.

I mean: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-11-01/satellite-images-expo...

It's hard to imagine the average person having access to this kind of reporting 40 years ago. (the 1990 was 30 years ago next year...)

Re: GitHub tries to quell employee anger over its ICE contract

#186

Post by madhadron »

hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #154
commandlinefan wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I also have to wonder what percentage of GitHub’s employees _are_ non-US citizens. Every programming job I’ve ever had in the U.S. was for a company that was staffed by at least 90% foreigners; if they see U.S. immigration as an adversary, they may be opposing any contract on personal grounds.

> Every programming job I’ve ever had in the U.S. was for a company that was staffed by at least 90% foreigners. Where the hell are you working? I'm going to call bullshit, because it's really not that easy to get a work visa in the US. You're saying 90% of your colleagues weren't US citizens?

It feels like closer to 50% noncitizen where I work, but could be closer to 90% if you include naturalized citizens.

Re: GitHub tries to quell employee anger over its ICE contract

#187

Post by kevinsundar »

umeshunni wrote: post #166
commandlinefan wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I also have to wonder what percentage of GitHub’s employees _are_ non-US citizens. Every programming job I’ve ever had in the U.S. was for a company that was staffed by at least 90% foreigners; if they see U.S. immigration as an adversary, they may be opposing any contract on personal grounds.

Even if a significant portion of GitHub's employees are non-US citizens, it's highly unlikely they're illegals.

As another commenter mentioned, the most factual way of describing that group of people is "people residing or working in the country illegally". There aren't laws against people, there are laws against what people do.

Re: GitHub tries to quell employee anger over its ICE contract

#188

Post by killface »

olah_1 wrote: post #61
pm90 wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> ICE is not a partisan organization, Only if you have your head deliberately under the sand in the face of all the reporting that has been done so far about wanton cruelty inflicted on human beings by this agency, including but not limited to: * separation of toddlers from their parents * horrific conditions in detention facilities * detaining immigrants for as long as they possibly can * arresting and trying to dep…

People that deliberately commit crimes typically suffer all of these things, yes. If you believe that illegally crossing a border is not a crime, then that's a different discussion that could be had.

It's a misdemeanor -- on the same level as jaywalking.

and for that, they get executed, their children get raped and sold into slavery, and their women simply disappear.

but sure, it's about punishing criminals :eyeroll:

Re: GitHub tries to quell employee anger over its ICE contract

#189

Post by bstar77 »

hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #154
commandlinefan wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I also have to wonder what percentage of GitHub’s employees _are_ non-US citizens. Every programming job I’ve ever had in the U.S. was for a company that was staffed by at least 90% foreigners; if they see U.S. immigration as an adversary, they may be opposing any contract on personal grounds.

> Every programming job I’ve ever had in the U.S. was for a company that was staffed by at least 90% foreigners. Where the hell are you working? I'm going to call bullshit, because it's really not that easy to get a work visa in the US. You're saying 90% of your colleagues weren't US citizens?

It's absolutely not bullshit. I've worked places where this is true and places where it isn't. In my experience, the former is more common.
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