I Accidentally Uncovered a Nationwide Scam on Airbnb • Hacker News Board

Re: I Accidentally Uncovered a Nationwide Scam on Airbnb

#421

Post by CamperBob2 » Thu, Oct 31, 2019, 8:49 PM UTC

dfxm12 wrote: post #104

mattrp wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would second this experience. We travel with our five kids and its sometimes impossible to find a hotel that can accommodate us. That said, I did experience a switcheroo in Chicago similar to the article. However that’s where the similarities end. The place was in the same neighborhood, it was comparable to the listing but the only catch was we were told not say Airbnb to anyone in the building but to say guests of…

I would say the part I find most disturbing about what I see on Airbnb is ... the presence of cameras in every room. One place we stayed at had obvious cameras on the outside but then just as I’m about to go to sleep I look up at the ceiling and there’s another one in the chandelier above the bed. Yeah, it's policy that you have to disclose any cameras inside the room in the listing. It's not clear what happens when…

Cameras are problematic for AirBnB due to the tremendous scam potential. Consider these scenarios:

1) I'm a scammer. I stay in an AirBnB. Before I leave, I conceal a small camera somewhere in the room, and proceed to make a big deal out of "discovering" it. The room is refunded and the host is penalized or worse.

2) I'm a pervert. I spend the night in an AirBnB. Before I leave, I conceal a small camera somewhere in the room. I get off by watching the resulting footage, get paid by selling it, or both.

3) I'm a renter. I spend the night in an AirBnB. In the morning, I find the camera left by Pervert #2, possibly months earlier. I scream bloody murder. I get refunded, and the host is penalized or worse. Pervert #2 simply goes back to Ali Express and buys another camera.

There are probably numerous other variations I'm not devious enough to think of, all of which leave the host holding the proverbial bag.

Re: I Accidentally Uncovered a Nationwide Scam on Airbnb

#422

Post by robocat » Thu, Oct 31, 2019, 8:49 PM UTC

Mediterraneo10 wrote: post #301

tempsy wrote: post #228

I find it pretty crazy that AirBnB's tech never really evolved on the host or guest side at all. The experience is still basically like a pretty Craigslist with payment processing. I sometimes wonder what an engineer there even does other than maintain a CRUD app. For example, why isn't there an Alexa-like concierge device in every AirBnB that answers guest questions by now? Why aren't there smart locks on every home…

> Why aren't there smart locks on every home that unlocks with the app? AirBnB is reportedly pressuring hosts to install smart locks, but they are getting pushback from hosts who like socializing with the people who come to stay at their property. Yes, a huge amount of AirBnB listings are faceless property developers now, but there is still a good slice of individual families renting out a spare flat. Sometimes the h…

> just want to quickly lock yourself in the rental and have some time alone

There needs to be some way to indicate that the guest wants minimal interaction, or that the host wants minimal interaction.

It is awkward when the host is nice, or trying hard to be nice, but actually you don't get on with them (I often get this with twee people).

I've stayed at places where the host almost seemed to be treating AirBnB as a dating agency. It's never been creepy, but it has been a tiny bit awkward! I remember one place where a young student host had hooked up with a guest, which seemed dodgy (although not my place to judge really!)

Re: I Accidentally Uncovered a Nationwide Scam on Airbnb

#423

Post by ejain » Thu, Oct 31, 2019, 8:50 PM UTC

lixtra wrote: post #411

ejain wrote: post #331

Just talked to someone at Airbnb. Two takeaways: 1. If the property does not match the description, take pictures (they won't just take your word for it). 2. If you are told that the original property is not available, contact Airbnb right away, and they will give you a full refund and help you find a place to stay (Airbnb or otherwise). Fortunately, I've never had to put any of this to the test...

> 2. If you are told that the original property is not available, contact Airbnb right away... Can you ask your friend how to contact Airbnb such that you get a reasonable fast response, say within 1h?

I don't know anyone at Airbnb, but simply contacted them via https://www.airbnb.com/help/contact-us/channel, and had someone respond right away. YMMV.

Re: I Accidentally Uncovered a Nationwide Scam on Airbnb

#424

Post by zwayhowder » Thu, Oct 31, 2019, 8:52 PM UTC

julienchastang wrote: post #51

There have been a few threads about AirBnb lately with a lot of people reporting negative experiences so I will add my own $0.02. I have stayed in many AirBnbs. The reason is, I find it is the only way to have a tolerable family vacation is when everyone has their own sleeping quarters. When we are all piled into one (often overpriced and not so clean) hotel room, it makes for less than ideal sleep and everyone ends…

As a family we do the same, but never in the US, we've been caught in a couple of scams the same as this article, fortunately when we were traveling for business not as a family, but still.

AirBnB in Australia, Japan & the UK has never been a problem for me. The USA has a 50% scam rate so far.

Re: I Accidentally Uncovered a Nationwide Scam on Airbnb

#425

Post by ghostbrainalpha » Thu, Oct 31, 2019, 8:52 PM UTC

koolba wrote: post #420

ghostbrainalpha wrote: post #401

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can't make a business of an honest marketplace based on selling services only to dishonest people. Eventually your own customers will ruin the business. This is the fundamental reason "Organized Crime" always fails in the end.

Isn’t that what all those credit card dump sites do?

I'm not saying you can't make the business work in the short term. But ultimately the more successful it becomes the faster it will fail.

Re: I Accidentally Uncovered a Nationwide Scam on Airbnb

#426

Post by greglindahl » Thu, Oct 31, 2019, 8:56 PM UTC

dotancohen wrote: post #311

MrQuincle wrote: post #223

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Note also that if a host cancels on you at the last moment, you can't give a negative review at all. That would never happen with a hotel.

This does happen with hotels, in fact a few posts up someone does mention this happening to them. That said, in December my ex wife had an Airbnb cancel just before her trip. She had to find another place in a hurry at twice the price.

You can usually leave a negative review for a hotel even if you didn't stay at it. AirBnB doesn't allow it.

Also, every time a hotel has not had a room when I showed up, they put me in a nearby hotel of similar or better quality. I'm sure that doesn't always happen, but it is the standard for quality hotel chains.

Re: I Accidentally Uncovered a Nationwide Scam on Airbnb

#427

Post by lixtra » Thu, Oct 31, 2019, 8:57 PM UTC

ejain wrote: post #423

lixtra wrote: post #411

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> 2. If you are told that the original property is not available, contact Airbnb right away... Can you ask your friend how to contact Airbnb such that you get a reasonable fast response, say within 1h?

I don't know anyone at Airbnb, but simply contacted them via https://www.airbnb.com/help/contact-us/channel , and had someone respond right away. YMMV.

Thanks. Your thread should be on top.

Re: I Accidentally Uncovered a Nationwide Scam on Airbnb

#428

Post by tomp » Thu, Oct 31, 2019, 8:59 PM UTC

yason wrote: post #335

The late cancellation by host without no specific penalties seems to be one of the most prevalent yet disturbing elements in this. The one who's travelling has the weakest odds of all. The traveler will be in a foreign place with no place to stay. In contrast, the host has no losing cards except some income. The rules should, thus, have been written to protect the traveler at the expense of the host because the host…

Still better than Uber where if the driver cancels more than 5 minutes after accepting the ride, the rider gets charged (as if the rider had cancelled).

They're very fast to issue refunds, but only if requested... I wonder how many people just never notice the fraudulent charge! One reason I minimally trust Uber and keep checking all their charges...

Re: I Accidentally Uncovered a Nationwide Scam on Airbnb

#429

Post by dsr_ » Thu, Oct 31, 2019, 9:01 PM UTC

The solution is the same as it is for so many other issues: strict liability for Airbnb. If the company is responsible for finding you a hotel room of equivalent capacity and paying for any difference in price, the company will quickly devote resources to minimizing this kind of fraud.

As long as it's not Airbnb's problem, Airbnb isn't going to solve it.

Re: I Accidentally Uncovered a Nationwide Scam on Airbnb

#430

Post by saghm » Thu, Oct 31, 2019, 9:01 PM UTC

CamperBob2 wrote: post #390

saghm wrote: post #381

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If the host really needs to cancel they should have to put the traveler in a real hotel as an upgrade to remove all doubt of the traveler getting into a place that could be worse. They have already received the money from the traveler so they only need to pay for the difference. New scam: post a listing for a very high-end place you don't own, cancel the booking once you've been paid and book the client a cheap hot…

Oh, and receive kickbacks from the hotel. Don't forget that part.

Oooh, good call!