Live data from Hacker News

I Accidentally Uncovered a Nationwide Scam on Airbnb

vice.com

321–330 of 632 posts

Re: I Accidentally Uncovered a Nationwide Scam on Airbnb

#321
TLDR the listings are fake.

You book a nice house and they'll tell you a problem came up, but they offer to switch to a different one. The alternative house is cheap and run down, it's their real property though. When you switch and stay one night at the alternative, you can't get a full refund. Because so many bail out and leave, expecting to be refunded, they can make it available to rent again immediately. You're also pressured into not leaving negative reviews, so the cycle continues.

Re: I Accidentally Uncovered a Nationwide Scam on Airbnb

#322
A few years back my wife and I went to Dubrovnik, this is before it went nuts due to GoT, I should add.

We went there with a couple of friends planning to have their wedding there, traveling from our homes in London.

We booked two air BnB rooms, both were very nice looking double rooms in central locations next to the old town.

We arrived at the address we'd been given and a local guy "owner", greeted us and took us for a short walk to where we'd be staying.

We arrived at an older looking home, high walls and a large metal gate. He opened it and welcomed us to his home. His grandma's home he told us.

He walked us inside and showed us to a box room with two wooden bunk-beds, the type you put children in. The floor was flooded and the small ensuite was too, flooded.

The look on our faces might have said enough if we hadn't, but we certainly were not staying there.

He suggested he'd try find some "alternative" accomodation. We waited nearby, and a short time later he arrived to show us each to locations he'd found.

First our friends, a nice newish apartment, they were quite happy with, although it was smaller than what they had booked, but still pleasant enough.

He took my wife and I around the corner and into a small home that had painted cement walls, flaking like you see in war films, after the war has been through.

An old man showed us to a small double room where he'd laid a bowl of fruit on the bed for us, he didn't speak English, but although we didn't speak his language either, we felt welcome, albeit slightly uncomfortable.

The place wasn't particularly clean or nice looking, and certainly not what we paid for, but after a bit of a dead end with the original guy we booked with, we figured he's guy is farming off rooms that don't exist and then subletting rooms in others' homes when guests arrived.

We decided we'd take it, but we needed to see the bathroom first.

Again, not clean, not pleasant, but worst of all, a small window, just above the shower opened into the old man's room, and it was open, is wasn't frosted and there was no way to cover it.

That was it for my wife, that was one bridge too far. She can't comfortably bath in there with a window opening into this stranger's room in a strange place.

We told the owner guy it wasn't going to work for us, and this is where the rest of this story breaks my heart.

The owner guy let the old man know we wouldn't stay, and the old guy broke down, he was begging us to stay, he was gesturing at the fruit he'd laid out, questioning what was wrong, but we just couldn't stay there.

The rest of what happened to us is irrelevant here, but the guy we'd booked with was clearly taking bookings he was farming out to elderly locals with any space to spare hoping renters works take whatever he offered.

Both sides of this deal were being scammed, and it broke my heart to know that although we might end up forking out to stay elsewhere was the worst we might suffer through this, this old man clearly needed whatever small part of the rent we paid was going to be given to him.

The rooms we saw online clearly didn't exist, this guy was just conning people because AirBnb allowed it to happen.

Re: I Accidentally Uncovered a Nationwide Scam on Airbnb

#323

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I issued a chargeback to Qatar Airways/Expedia for $1700 and they tried to fight it. Bank of America told them to go to hell, and that I was getting a full refund. I can still use Qatar and Expedia. Airbnb should not be allowed to ban me for this reason.

out of curiosity - what was the reason you did a charge back? how much information did you have to give BoA.

The plane was delayed 3 hours, which meant I would miss the connection in Qatar (en route to Singapore)

The result would mean that 75% of my trip would be spent not in Singapore. So I requested to leave the plane because the plane had to go back to the gate to refuel, because of how long it waited on the runway.

Qatar tried to argue that this wasn't their problem, but BoA told them to eat the cost. Two sides of the same coin. I would have accepted a partial refund but BoA gave full refund.

Re: I Accidentally Uncovered a Nationwide Scam on Airbnb

#324
post #84

This scam is common in Europe as well. Something very similar happened to me in London where I was seemingly renting from a nice regular person who had a single well reviewed listing. Once I arrived I was met by some guy from a property company who said he "worked with" the lister and he was going to move us to some place better. He showed us a total dump with dilapidated Ikea junk. He basically threatened us with po…

Did you try to do a credit card charge back?

Re: I Accidentally Uncovered a Nationwide Scam on Airbnb

#325
post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's essentially what I was thinking even when reading the article. Get a good credit card company that's on your side (Amex has been best for me, Discover too), and let them deal with it. They absolutely will not screw around with stuff like this.

Yup, fraud like this is exactly what chargebacks are for. Companies don't listen to anything but money. AirBNB counts on you being a pushover and not disputing the charge. I don't understand this "Well they charged my credit card so there's nothing I can do!" attitude.

Just be aware that a chargeback is an instant bridge-igniter with the company or platform you’re filing it against, most considering it a breach of the TOS and banning your account.

Re: I Accidentally Uncovered a Nationwide Scam on Airbnb

#326
post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Try calling your Credit Card company and flag it as fraud. That's what I would do. That failing I'd submit a police report.

That doesn't work well b/c then Airbnb just bans you from the platform

I did this twice with AMEX and they didn't ban me. The second time they even apologized and gave me credits.

Re: I Accidentally Uncovered a Nationwide Scam on Airbnb

#327
There is a larger problem here: there seems to be no way to hold these big internet companies to account for misrepresenting their product offerings. For example, some time ago, someone on HN reported on a plagiarized Python book for sale on Amazon. (https://www.amazon.com/Python-Programming-Beginner-Intermedi...). I emailed the author of the original book,(October 4) because Amazon have a form that allows authors to report plagiarism. This is what he replied to me:

"Thank you for your note. Someone else discovered this and notified me three weeks ago. I went to the Amazon copyright infringement webpage and filled out the form. The automated email told me to expect a formal response in 1-2 business days. That was three weeks ago, and I’m still waiting."

So Amazon have, for more than a month, been told that they are selling a stolen book. And yet the listing is still there.

Now if I reported that my local bricks-and-mortar second-hand store was selling my stolen TV set, I'll bet that the police would be there pretty quickly. But Amazon and BnB can sell stolen goods or misrepresent offerings with impunity. This is not right.

Re: I Accidentally Uncovered a Nationwide Scam on Airbnb

#328

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've definitely had that "If anybody asks you are guests of Tiffany" from the bearded guy doing the checkin. Apparently the building management was hostile to AirBNB, but the funny thing is that we saw the occupants of two other apartments on the same floor that were clearly people on vacation just like us. I had a strong suspicion that most of the building was bought up by foreign investors and turned into AirBNB re…

>> I mean yeah, it feels sketchy as hell Usually does when you are participating in fraud.

He said he was told at checkin, your options are pretty limited at that point. Especially when you have only soft/anecdotal evidence it is actually in some vague way not legit. “If anyone asks, you’re guests of Tiffany” is not a definitively incriminating statement, and the fact that building management is hostile to Airbnb doesn’t mean any lease or city code is being violated.

Ideally there would be an anonymous review system to let people disclose this sort of fuzzy evidence though because who wants to be party to a sketchy situation? Not only are there legit Airbnb’s, there are long-standing legit vacation rental markets (think summer cabins) where Airbnb is taking over from the old alternative sites. So it’s not like every Airbnb listing is circumventing the law.

Re: I Accidentally Uncovered a Nationwide Scam on Airbnb

#329
People who have been scammed like this on Airbnb: did you a book a well-reviewed place? As a precaution, I only stay in places with at least ~50 happy, realistic reviews. I've stayed in maybe a dozen such places and never run into anything worse than slightly unclear arrival instructions.

I'm not saying Airbnb is great, but I'm curious as to what these eventual scams looked like at the outset.

I suppose it's possible for someone to maintain a legitimate place to accumulate good reviews and then scam some fraction of people, but the existence of the legitimate place is still a nontrivial hurdle for a scammer.

Maybe I overestimate how hard it is to get 50 good reviews.

Re: I Accidentally Uncovered a Nationwide Scam on Airbnb

#330
post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Try to get refund from AirBnb for misprepresentation or deliberate omissions of negative points. -I don’t know whether their policy differs from country to country, but after using AirBnb 30+ times traveling with wife and three kids in Northern/Central Europe, I’ve only had two issues - once the place we were to stay was double-booked (and we arrived last!); the other it turned out what was described as a ‘bedroom’…

I don't want a refund in either of those cases so much as a place to stay that matches my requirements NOW. (good customer service says the replacement will be better, hotels try to reserve their best suites until last just to ensure that they have the better room around just in case). I'm some new city and I want to get my family to sleep...

To me it sounds as if you are saying "I want the charm\location\social experience of staying with a local resident AND I want the convenience/professionalism/capital resources of the hotel industry AND I don't want to pay for the convenience/professionalism/capital resources of a hotel."

As with software, pick two.

Post reply on HN