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Piper Announces First GA Aircraft with Autoland Capability

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Re: Piper Announces First GA Aircraft with Autoland Capability

#61

Post by Stevvo »

asdfman123 wrote: post #53
eternalny1 wrote: post #24

This is a seriously impressive bit of software engineering. It seems as simple as "push a button" to the layman but what happens when: There is a thunderstorm between the airport and the runway The nearest runway is closed due to a blizzard There is a mountain between the normal 3-degree glide-slope and the runway, an "offset approach" There is a 40-knot crosswind You have an engine out That's just a few, I'm a comme…

Question: how close are we to totally self-flying planes? I feel like we could easily get there before we got self-driving cars, if we wanted to. Would the costs for short hops be comparable to a commercial airplane ticket? Because it would be awesome to charter small flights from an app to jump to a nearby city.

The technology already exists, it's a much easier problem than self driving cars. Spacecraft can fly themselves to other planets and return. That is a massively more complex problem.

It's a problem of trust, and regulation, not a technical one.

Re: Piper Announces First GA Aircraft with Autoland Capability

#62

Post by Daviey »

nabla9 wrote: post #31
eternalny1 wrote: post #24

This is a seriously impressive bit of software engineering. It seems as simple as "push a button" to the layman but what happens when: There is a thunderstorm between the airport and the runway The nearest runway is closed due to a blizzard There is a mountain between the normal 3-degree glide-slope and the runway, an "offset approach" There is a 40-knot crosswind You have an engine out That's just a few, I'm a comme…

It's to be used only in the event that the pilot is incapacitated. Because it's an emergency feature engaged by a passenger or automatically, it probably can't manage all complex situations. It may be just good weather emergency landing. Check fuel and wind, steer to nearest emergency airport and land. Best effort is better than no effort and dying. > There is a mountain between the normal 3-degree glide-slope and th…

> Cruise missiles have had similar technology for a long time.

I try to make my landings a little less eventful.

Re: Piper Announces First GA Aircraft with Autoland Capability

#63

Post by jimktrains2 »

sansnomme wrote: post #33

How does it communicate with ground station? Voice recognition and speech synthesis?

I have 100% no familiarity, but I'd assume it's not processing voice from the ground. It is probably only announcing that this is an emergency and its intended course of action.

I would love to know if that's not true because that would be a huge leap in off-line speech processing and recognition.

Re: Piper Announces First GA Aircraft with Autoland Capability

#65

Post by griffinkelly »

eternalny1 wrote: post #24

This is a seriously impressive bit of software engineering. It seems as simple as "push a button" to the layman but what happens when: There is a thunderstorm between the airport and the runway The nearest runway is closed due to a blizzard There is a mountain between the normal 3-degree glide-slope and the runway, an "offset approach" There is a 40-knot crosswind You have an engine out That's just a few, I'm a comme…

I've flown airplanes with solid GA plane autopilot that'll fly down to decision height, but you still have to put in flaps, gear, change throttle. To have an airplane do all that on its own is quite impressive, particularly to do a 'nearest' type input on a Garmin then to land it on the appropriate runway, still confuses me sometimes if its a new airport I've never been at.

I'd be interested to know if it declares an emergency, squawks 7700 and controllers are expected to give it a priority and right of way?

Re: Piper Announces First GA Aircraft with Autoland Capability

#66

Post by Stevvo »

mtw wrote: post #64

Does this aircraft have LIDAR or cameras? Wondering how it works with other air traffic and potential collisions. This is one of the biggest challenges for self-driving cars and I can't see any details about this in the Garmin G3000

The G3000 has ADBS in/out, and from January 1st ADSB out will be mandatory in the US, so it will know where other traffic is. Additionally, the autoland talks to ATC, and ATC can tell other traffic to get out of the way.

Re: Piper Announces First GA Aircraft with Autoland Capability

#67

Post by usrusr »

ceejayoz wrote: post #60
joshvm wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> During all phases of flight it communicates with passengers and appropriate air traffic control facilities regarding the new flight plan route and estimated time until landing. Which would suggest that if you need to be vectored to a runway, the aircraft can negotiate that with ATC automatically (and perhaps ATC can advise which is the most appropriate diversion?) This in the situation where the pilot is incapacita…

> Which would suggest that if you need to be vectored to a runway, the aircraft can negotiate that with ATC automatically (and perhaps ATC can advise which is the most appropriate diversion?) I strongly suspect it just announces itself. "N123FOO DECLARING EMERGENCY; PILOT INCAPACITATED, AUTOLAND ENGAGED; CLEAR RUNWAY 21L; 12 MILES OUT" sort of stuff.

Still makes me wonder: do you really need/want all that automation or would it make more sense to prepare for putting a remote pilot into the loop? Not for virtually holding the stick, but for looking at telemetry, communicating and doing all the high level decisions.

Re: Piper Announces First GA Aircraft with Autoland Capability

#68

Post by PacketPaul »

asdfman123 wrote: post #53
eternalny1 wrote: post #24

This is a seriously impressive bit of software engineering. It seems as simple as "push a button" to the layman but what happens when: There is a thunderstorm between the airport and the runway The nearest runway is closed due to a blizzard There is a mountain between the normal 3-degree glide-slope and the runway, an "offset approach" There is a 40-knot crosswind You have an engine out That's just a few, I'm a comme…

Question: how close are we to totally self-flying planes? I feel like we could easily get there before we got self-driving cars, if we wanted to. Would the costs for short hops be comparable to a commercial airplane ticket? Because it would be awesome to charter small flights from an app to jump to a nearby city.

We have them now, just not passenger carrying. Military drones are autonomous.

Re: Piper Announces First GA Aircraft with Autoland Capability

#69

Post by rkangel »

dsfyu404ed wrote: post #56
anonu wrote: post #8

Not to be a philistine about new technology: but somehow I think this would make people in the air and in the ground less safe. It's probably like having a parachute on the plane: just a great marketing sales point.

If this system doesn't alert the outside world that it's been used more than a few intoxicated people are gonna use it to land at uncontrolled airports. Just get close and press the magic button. Net safety will probably increase because most people will never have that use case though.

It will advertise an emergency on the radio and with the transponder, so that ATC can clear traffic out of the way.

Re: Piper Announces First GA Aircraft with Autoland Capability

#70

Post by forgottenpass »

asdfman123 wrote: post #53
eternalny1 wrote: post #24

This is a seriously impressive bit of software engineering. It seems as simple as "push a button" to the layman but what happens when: There is a thunderstorm between the airport and the runway The nearest runway is closed due to a blizzard There is a mountain between the normal 3-degree glide-slope and the runway, an "offset approach" There is a 40-knot crosswind You have an engine out That's just a few, I'm a comme…

Question: how close are we to totally self-flying planes? I feel like we could easily get there before we got self-driving cars, if we wanted to. Would the costs for short hops be comparable to a commercial airplane ticket? Because it would be awesome to charter small flights from an app to jump to a nearby city.

>Because it would be awesome to charter small flights from an app to jump to a nearby city.

I doubt the cost of a pilot's time alone is a big enough factor to meaningfully change the number of people with access to chartered flights.

The other costs (hours of plane time, fuel, ramp fee, parking fees, maintenance) probably dwarf pilot time as a percentage of total cost. And you're either pushing the absolute unreliability of aviation [0] to the customers who are now trapped in a different city, or they're paying even more to the app to have backup plans ready to roll.

[0] Commercial aviation deals at a scale that can absorb flights that don't keep their plan. You go to the counter, get rebooked, and angrily eat some shitty fast food. When something goes wrong on a private flight, you're pacing around on the tarmac at 1 am, 3 states away from home and have to be at work in the morning.

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