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Microsoft Access: The Database Software That Won't Die

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Re: Microsoft Access: The Database Software That Won't Die

#141

Post by mamcx »

taffer wrote: post #109
mamcx wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My dream is to build a modern take of the fox/dbase family. I starting with the inner language http://tablam.org Access, as concept, is great . Is exactly what many need. But it have a lot of small deficiencies that make it disliked by developers. I have used FoxPro, and it have almost all the right things instead (Fox is Access, but goooood!... except a bit less user friendly). I wish I could dedicate to build this.…

I really like the idea of developing a modern Access alternative, but why are you trying to create a new language? Aren't QBE and SQL sufficient? Why not something that is like a cloud SaaS version of Access, but can be extended with some procedures and later used as a GraphQL backend like Hasura?

SQL/GraphQL are query languages. Good for that, but not for fully develop an app.

FoxPro have his own language that allow mix SQL and imperative constructs:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Visual_FoxPro

This mean:

* You code login in foxpro

* And the stored procedures

* And the forms

* And the reports

* And the script glues

* ....

"Just" adding SQL/GraphQL to a RDBMS is absolutely not enough. Both are too limited.

For example:

- Can you build a btree with SQL? No

- Work with the terminal? No

- Make a visual grid? No

- etc

Only query and maybe crud.

Re: Microsoft Access: The Database Software That Won't Die

#142

Post by selestify »

bob1029 wrote: post #110
jotakami wrote: post #59

A number of years ago I was in the Navy and worked in an electronics shop on an aircraft carrier. We were responsible for calibrating and repairing all the test and measurement equipment for the entire ship as well as the squadrons that we carried with us. Easily over 10k individual pieces of equipment, each of which had to be calibrated on a specific schedule. Most of this data was managed centrally, and we sent/rec…

Being able to automate forms can absolutely revolutionize some businesses. Many business owners have no idea the extent to which automation is feasible here. I have seen fully manual paper process (printers/scanners/pen & ink/shredders/etc.) go into 100% digital realm and the impact it had on the business. It really is incredible the difference it makes. The most interesting factor was the fact that now that the inpu…

How frequent was actual human intervention required? Every few hours?

Re: Microsoft Access: The Database Software That Won't Die

#143

Post by bob1029 »

selestify wrote: post #142
bob1029 wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Being able to automate forms can absolutely revolutionize some businesses. Many business owners have no idea the extent to which automation is feasible here. I have seen fully manual paper process (printers/scanners/pen & ink/shredders/etc.) go into 100% digital realm and the impact it had on the business. It really is incredible the difference it makes. The most interesting factor was the fact that now that the inpu…

How frequent was actual human intervention required? Every few hours?

Depends on lots of factors. Most maintenance is preventative in that context, so its hard to pin down a specific thing that would break down first or how long it would take. If something does break unexpectedly its usually treated as a big deal every time so it never happens again.

Re: Microsoft Access: The Database Software That Won't Die

#144

Post by flukus »

alexis_fr wrote: post #101
SigmundA wrote: post #30

I have a special place in my heart for Access, its where I first started making money writing software and learned SQL and VB. Its where I really felt like I was making something that solved real world problems for people, quickly at that. It was actually amazing how far it could scale, you could put a shared MDB file out on a Novell network share and have 30 concurrent users with no server app at all, users just dou…

Modern-day Access: Filemaker Pro was the contemporary competitor and still lives and has usergroups today; Airtables and similar (all SQL-based form managers) are the modern options.

Unfortunately it silently fails.

Years ago I worked for a company that claimed to have largest Filemaker Pro database in the southern hemisphere. One day there was some sort of disk issue and filemaker silently failed, then for months it kept pretending that everything was fine, it just wasn't writing to disk. This lasted until a power outage one day when the company discovered it had lost months of customer data, no backups of course, the backup system was working fine but there was no new information being written.

Data loss isn't forgivable, especially in the non-technical user space that filemaker is aiming for.

Re: Microsoft Access: The Database Software That Won't Die

#145

Post by dwd »

I don't get asked about working with Microsoft Access that often, except when it comes to interfacing an online store with a POS or Accounting system.

MYOB Retail Manager, which you will find in many bricks & mortar stores as their POS system (often with multiple registers), uses MS Access as its database.

Why they never switched to SQLite or MSSQL Lite I don't know but it's there, does the job most of the time (except when it corrupts itself) and there's no value in moving away from it, and going all-out online is a big scary change for them.

Re: Microsoft Access: The Database Software That Won't Die

#146

Post by [deleted] »

bob1029 wrote: post #110
jotakami wrote: post #59

A number of years ago I was in the Navy and worked in an electronics shop on an aircraft carrier. We were responsible for calibrating and repairing all the test and measurement equipment for the entire ship as well as the squadrons that we carried with us. Easily over 10k individual pieces of equipment, each of which had to be calibrated on a specific schedule. Most of this data was managed centrally, and we sent/rec…

Being able to automate forms can absolutely revolutionize some businesses. Many business owners have no idea the extent to which automation is feasible here. I have seen fully manual paper process (printers/scanners/pen & ink/shredders/etc.) go into 100% digital realm and the impact it had on the business. It really is incredible the difference it makes. The most interesting factor was the fact that now that the inpu…

[deleted]

Re: Microsoft Access: The Database Software That Won't Die

#147

Post by MisterOctober »

bdcravens wrote: post #123
MisterOctober wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Airtable is really good for what it does : makes data-driven tools available for folks who don't want to mess with writing queries or being a DBA, and also has a reasonable API for automations. For heavy stuff, I'll take Postgres anyday given the choice, but Airtable is great for small user-maintainable tools + dashboards, etc

I think Airtable is great, but it’s lack of aggregate functions really restricts it.

I certainly agree it's no replacement for a proper DB when full SQL functionality is needed, but it does have basic aggregates like count(), sum(), etc, available as formula fields: https://support.airtable.com/hc/en-us/articles/203255215-For...

Re: Microsoft Access: The Database Software That Won't Die

#149

Post by raintrees »

I, too, still have solutions in use as LOB apps based on Access. I have looked at other tools, being an officionado of Python, I started there. Got sidelined/sidetracked by Django, came back around to plain Python 3. Then I have to pick a GUI, currently playing with QT4, then get the DB connection working, hopefully against MySQL/MariaDB so I can have the solution multi-platformed... And so on.

I already have my annual revenue needs met by a service business, this is now all a side-hustle thing, but it has been a slog.

I do appreciate QT's visual Designer app, it makes creating forms more like Access/VB.

Re: Microsoft Access: The Database Software That Won't Die

#150

Post by alexhutcheson »

DaiPlusPlus wrote: post #98
asdfman123 wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder how many people became actual programmers due to Access. I feel like MS can't remove it just like you can't remove the second rung of a ladder.

Even if MS feels they can't remove it - the fact they haven't made any significant improvements to it (even those to keep it usable on modern computers) means it will die a slow death and leave people stranded - the same way they did with VB6. For example, the SQL text editor in Access is so broken if you copy and paste tab characters they're displayed as zero-width and break text rendering (if you click+drag to crea…

The SQL text editor in Access is so frustrating! As soon as you switch the tab you're looking at, it will change your carefully-formatted query into a condensed unreadable mess.
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