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Thank You, Guido

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Re: Thank You, Guido

#71

Post by Cthulhu_ »

skellera wrote: post #45
notkaiho wrote: post #2

"“When asked, I would give people my opinion that maintainable code is more important than clever code,” he said. “If I encountered clever code that was particularly cryptic, and I had to do some maintenance on it, I would probably rewrite it. So I led by example, and also by talking to other people.”" This is very sage advice.

You’d think it would be common sense when writing something that other people will read. We don’t see people writing books in acronyms or omitting words. How come so many people try to use code to show how smart they are?

You say that, but then there's more advanced writings like scientific papers which will freely use domain-specific terms and / or maths; I'm not saying that's bad, it's just that because I'm not at home with these terms and / or subjects I won't invest the time in trying to decipher it. Also because unlike with code, I don't actually have to of course.

Re: Thank You, Guido

#72

Post by jgwil2 »

cookie_monsta wrote: post #57
jgwil2 wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Python is well-designed for what it is, and it certainly seems intuitive compared to bash or perl or whatever people were using before, but it is opinionated in a way that makes it hard to write anything but procedural-style code. That quality draws some people to it, but it's not a language that can be everything to everyone.

> it's not a language that can be everything to everyone. Unlike say, for example...?

I'll probably get shit on for saying this, but JS comes closer. It's multi-paradigm, performant, and TS provides static type checking for those that want it. Of course, JS is also a language that gets excoriated for being poorly designed, so maybe intuitive design and adaptability are fundamentally at odds with each other.

Re: Thank You, Guido

#73

Post by chipgap98 »

skellera wrote: post #45
notkaiho wrote: post #2

"“When asked, I would give people my opinion that maintainable code is more important than clever code,” he said. “If I encountered clever code that was particularly cryptic, and I had to do some maintenance on it, I would probably rewrite it. So I led by example, and also by talking to other people.”" This is very sage advice.

You’d think it would be common sense when writing something that other people will read. We don’t see people writing books in acronyms or omitting words. How come so many people try to use code to show how smart they are?

That metaphor doesn't hold up. Literature is full of allegories, figures of speech, allusion, and other forms of imagery.

I agree that code should be as straightforward as possible, but I don't think books follow that rule.

Re: Thank You, Guido

#74

Post by vkat »

notkaiho wrote: post #2

"“When asked, I would give people my opinion that maintainable code is more important than clever code,” he said. “If I encountered clever code that was particularly cryptic, and I had to do some maintenance on it, I would probably rewrite it. So I led by example, and also by talking to other people.”" This is very sage advice.

I think this is what experience teaches. Sometimes I have the itch to write clever code but then more often than not it ends up being cryptic to other developers. If you really have to write clever code, wrap it up in a well defined interface and write a bunch of tests.

Re: Thank You, Guido

#75

Post by aksx »

skellera wrote: post #45
notkaiho wrote: post #2

"“When asked, I would give people my opinion that maintainable code is more important than clever code,” he said. “If I encountered clever code that was particularly cryptic, and I had to do some maintenance on it, I would probably rewrite it. So I led by example, and also by talking to other people.”" This is very sage advice.

You’d think it would be common sense when writing something that other people will read. We don’t see people writing books in acronyms or omitting words. How come so many people try to use code to show how smart they are?

Sometimes it's not about show how smart they are, developers aren't clear about the code they are writing.

when I write code for a concept i don't understand completely, it tends to be complex and cryptic. I'll go back to it after trying to understand the problem and the problem space more and be able to write simpler code.

Re: Thank You, Guido

#76

Post by michaelcampbell »

iandanforth wrote: post #49
dragonsh wrote: post #8

Language, its community and development model is a reflection of its creator and his philosophy. So Without meeting the creator Guido, through language and its community I can see is very humble and care about things besides solving computer science problems. May be this is one of the reasons of success of Python and its community which is open, humble, friendly and inclusive. In my startup we have been using Python…

I'll also add "silly." A not-too-serious attitude from day one helps protect a community (IMO). When your language is named after a surrealist comedy troupe it kinda takes the wind out of the sails of moral outrage. Whimsy is surprisingly powerful.

Which is odd to me; I resisted using python much because of the rabid culture around it, and I tried, several times. They didn't get the nickname "pythonistas" for nothing, nor in jest.

It is much, much better of late (I was thrust into a role a year ago where I am doing 95% of my coding in python now). I'm not sure what's changed; I had assumed it was the "core" culturalists were diluted by the influx of ML people, but it is only an assumption.

Re: Thank You, Guido

#77

Post by FpUser »

greenshackle2 wrote: post #62
FpUser wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Simple question leads to downvoting? Looks like we have a knight in shining armor protecting the castle of Python.

Questions made in bad faith tend to be downvoted. Is this really a suprise?

I do not see any bad faith here. I just disagreed to the original point. Anyways it looks to me that anything said against Python is big no.

Btw. I do use Python, for complex shell scripts mostly.

Re: Thank You, Guido

#78

Post by FpUser »

jtms wrote: post #69
FpUser wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Simple question leads to downvoting? Looks like we have a knight in shining armor protecting the castle of Python.

The condescending and arrogant tone got you downvoted both here and in your previous comment

There is nothing condescending and arrogant here. It looks like the other side is being way too touchy. Anyways I got the message: stay away from anything that questions Python being the best thing since sliced bread.

Re: Thank You, Guido

#79

Post by 3pt14159 »

not2b wrote: post #16

Did you notice this: "He has already put into motion the conversion of the Dropbox server code from Python 2 to Python 3." Even the company that hired Guido is still heavily dependent on Python 2, and it doesn't surprise me at all; my own employer still has a lot of it in internal tools.

I'm starting to long for a stack that doesn't constantly change. Just set the features and that's it. Security updates only after that. It feels like a constant grind keeping up with everything. Containers, clouds, programming languages, operating systems, frontend frameworks, transfer protocols, it seems like it takes so much effort to just build something and keep it going. That Python 2 is still around doesn't really surprise me. Many of the projects that were built upon it were built by non-developers (scientists, etc) that have no strong reason to keep everything current.

Re: Thank You, Guido

#80

Post by this_na_hipster »

Thank you Guido for all you did for this community. While others have pointed out your contributions to the Python community, I have found inspiration in how you paved a path to the engineering culture all around us. In a time when career progression was to transition into management after a certain degree of tenure, your adamant refusal to stay technical and "just code" has shaped my personal views and my own aspirations for my career. You will always be cherished
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