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After Spike in Deaths, New York to Get 250 Miles of Protected Bike Lanes

nytimes.com

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Re: After Spike in Deaths, New York to Get 250 Miles of Protected Bike Lanes

#201

Post by u801e »

mynameisvlad wrote: post #165
u801e wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> And the same person is a driver on one day and a biker on another. Yes, but cyclists try to act like pedestrians and move at speeds typical of vehicles. Pedestrians typically move between 2 to 6 mph. Cyclists move between 10 to 30 mph. While a motorist can see a pedestrian approaching a crosswalk and yield to them, it's much harder for them to see a cyclist in time to yield to them because of how much faster they m…

You've completely missed the parent's point. It's not productive to lump every cyclist together, or every driver together. At the end of the day, people are people, and some people who happen to be cyclist are shitty, while others who happen to be drivers are assholes. But that doesn't mean ALL cyclists are assholes, or all drivers.

I never said that all cyclists, motorists, or pedestrians are "assholes". I just said that if a cyclist tries to act like a pedestrian at cyclist speed, then collisions (with pedestrians and/or motorists) are more likely.

Re: After Spike in Deaths, New York to Get 250 Miles of Protected Bike Lanes

#202

Post by kevin_thibedeau »

TulliusCicero wrote: post #161
msoad wrote: post #72

If you don't live in NYC you should know that a lot of bicycles in NYC are delivery guys riding electrified bicycles that go up to 20MpH. Many of them don't wear helmets and ride dangerously. I don't have anything to back this tip but the raise of deaths can be linked to raise of electric bicycles

I mean, 20mph isn't actually that fast. It's pretty easy to exceed that on a road bike, even if you're not in the best shape. Their stronger acceleration is probably a bigger problem.

It's more they they habitually run red lights and go the wrong way. It's very easy to not see them coming from a direction that a car can't come from when they're obscured by parked vehicles.

Re: After Spike in Deaths, New York to Get 250 Miles of Protected Bike Lanes

#203

Post by TulliusCicero »

gok wrote: post #187
TulliusCicero wrote: post #177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Protected intersections are also a thing. They didn't exist in the US at all until like 2015, but they're starting to become more common. They don't make safety 100% perfect, obviously, but they do make things substantially better.

That just means they add bicycle setbacks in an attempt to scare drivers. It doesn't solve the problem when people are routinely allowed to drive without demonstrating an understanding of how a traffic light is supposed to be interpreted.

It does partially solve the problem. Protected intersections make lanes of walking and biking much more obvious to drivers, and the curbs are such that drivers slow down more and have better visibility.

Re: After Spike in Deaths, New York to Get 250 Miles of Protected Bike Lanes

#204

Post by adventured »

rapnie wrote: post #196

This is great! For inspiration: "From The Netherlands to America: Translating the world's best bikeway designs" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kp3s2EP0zVo

The US is in a fortunate position with regards to public transportation. It doesn't need to invent anything new at all to dramatically improve its position: copy the things in Europe and places like Japan that work. It makes it all the more annoying that we're lagging so hard on the copying when it's so obvious.

Re: After Spike in Deaths, New York to Get 250 Miles of Protected Bike Lanes

#205

Post by TulliusCicero »

nemo44x wrote: post #190
TulliusCicero wrote: post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Mandatory bike registration is a terrible idea, but I got no problem with fining people who ride dangerously.

Make it simple with a 5% tax on any new bike purchased in the city. Call it the “bike lane preservation fund”.

Why would we want to make it more expensive to bike, when it's better for the environment and saves the city money as it is?

Some German cities are going in the opposite direction, giving subsidies for people to purchase electric cargo bikes.

Re: After Spike in Deaths, New York to Get 250 Miles of Protected Bike Lanes

#206

Post by u801e »

Aaronmacaron wrote: post #157
u801e wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I think a lot of accidents where the car turns right and overlooks a bike in the blind spot can be prevented through [the separate bike signal] measure. This can also be prevented by not trying to pass right turning vehicles on the right and only pass them on their left.

If bikes drove on the left side of the lane it would be impossible for cars to overtake bikes. (Overtaking on the right is illegal.)

Drivers of vehicles are supposed to pass on the left, so they can switch lanes to pass when safe to do so.

Re: After Spike in Deaths, New York to Get 250 Miles of Protected Bike Lanes

#207

Post by mumblemumble »

e40 wrote: post #109
OutsmartDan wrote: post #62

As an avid cyclist in NYC, this is a huge step forward into cyclist protection. I can't tell you how many times i've almost been hit, or doored, by a car. Sometimes, it's a lot safer to run a red light to get in front of a car versus waiting for the light to turn- but of course that's not legal. Honestly, as huge and condensed NYC is, I am surprised this hasn't happened years ago. It's much, much more efficient to ge…

As a pedestrian, I've often thought that. There are no cars coming (in the direction that has the right of way), but if I wait, the cars waiting to turn might not yield to me. My threshold for cars entering my personal space is clearly different than drivers. I've had drivers accelerate toward me and pass me with 1-2' of space. Way too close. My rule, as a driver is simple: never accelerate toward a pedestrian. That…

There seems to be something about being cocooned in a thousand or so kilos of steel and glass that causes people to forget that some of the things outside of your moving box aren't just obstacles to get around, they're actually sentient beings that deserve to be treated with courtesy and respect.

Re: After Spike in Deaths, New York to Get 250 Miles of Protected Bike Lanes

#208

Post by ogre_codes »

mumblemumble wrote: post #197
shaboi wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Chicago has been doing a pretty good job of building out bike lanes. But it needs to be taken further still, and more quickly. However, the initiative needs a more robust implementation, with more consideration of driver behavior and parking needs. This is evident as many delivery trucks, Ubers etc. park in the lane (albeit, with emergency blinkers on, but it's a moot measure regardless) and push bicyclists into traf…

Based on what I've seen in Chicago, it seems that the missing element is informing the public of the relevant laws. To my knowledge, the rules covering bicycles and pedestrians have never been on Illinois's written test, they aren't necessarily covered in driver's (or other) education, and, since most motorists (and also, I'm guessing, cyclists) come from more suburban environments where there just aren't as many bik…

If cars are driving in bike lanes then it's not very good bike infrastructure. The best bike & pedestrian infrastructure is isolated from auto infrastructure as much as possible. Drivers take up every possible piece of real estate available and steal space from adjoining infrastructure when they can get away with it.

Re: After Spike in Deaths, New York to Get 250 Miles of Protected Bike Lanes

#209

Post by u801e »

JoeAltmaier wrote: post #154
u801e wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I think a lot of accidents where the car turns right and overlooks a bike in the blind spot can be prevented through [the separate bike signal] measure. This can also be prevented by not trying to pass right turning vehicles on the right and only pass them on their left.

Typically the car passes the bike which is riding to the right. Then the car turns right directly in front of the bike. Forgetting it was there, even though they just swerved around it.

That's because the driver believes the cyclist is going much slower than they actually are, but this can be mitigated by taking the lane when approaching an intersection such that the driver of the faster vehicle will make the turn from the same lane the cyclist is in.

But there's another scenario where a cyclist is passing traffic on the right and then gets right-hooked by a vehicle making a right turn.

Re: After Spike in Deaths, New York to Get 250 Miles of Protected Bike Lanes

#210

Post by thatswrong0 »

anonu wrote: post #192

The "horrifying" crash mentioned in the article is indeed horrifying. I bike a lot in NYC (consistently for 10+ years now) and I think I am pretty cautious and defensive. But there's absolutely nothing the guy could have done in the video. I linked it below because its a good reminder that your fate is never 100% in your hands. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i0kqsUnpGlU

As a pedestrian in SF, I'm _always_ keeping my eyes peeled for bullshit like this, esp. when I'm standing on the corner like that other fella was (he could easily have been taken out instead). It just takes one idiot to ruin your day / life. I usually try to keep at least one somewhat substantial object (post / utility box) between me and the road.. but otherwise I'm keeping an eye out for an errant turn or red-light runner in case I need to book it.

Another thing I'd like to see are narrower roads along with wider sidewalks.. hopefully that would somewhat help deter speeding like in the above video.

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