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Around 30 percent of children in the U.S. don't get enough sleep: study

newsweek.com

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Re: Around 30 percent of children in the U.S. don't get enough sleep: study

#71

Post by barry-cotter »

watwut wrote: post #60
barry-cotter wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I stayed up til the same time reading books for the same reason OP stayed up, not being tired. Teenagers have a delayed sleep cycle compared to adults, it’s not a matter of choice, it’s when your body says to wake up or sleep autonomously, same as my baby wakes at 5am and sleeps at 8pm, because that’s what his body is telling him to do.

Babies dont wake up at 5 not go to sleep at 8. Their sleep can be highly irregular or regular, may be affected by light or not. And when it is affected by light, you can make the room dark in the morning. Babies don't have a clock.

I didn’t say babies do anything. I was talking about one specific child, with whose behavior I have intimate experience. His sleep and wake patterns are definitely not precise enough to set a clock by them but he really does generally go to sleep around eight and he’s awake between five and six in the morning, dark or bright, usually closer to five.

Re: Around 30 percent of children in the U.S. don't get enough sleep: study

#72

Post by mkl »

pfranz wrote: post #55
gruez wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>By that logic, if we moved school to 5 am, he would have simply only stayed up until 10 pm. I believe that. >Is that particularly realistic? The only issue is that at 5am, there won't be daylight during the winter. Lack of daylight presents safety issues and makes it more difficult to wake up.

It's pretty well studied that most teenagers stay up late. My freshman year of high school my school was under construction so I was bussed across town. Which meant I had to wake up close to 5am. I don't remember staying up especially late, but I was perpetually tired. Id sleep on the bus both ways. In college I had a semester when I had a 5am class. I found it much easier to stay up all night and crash after than to…

A 5am class? That sounds insane! What was the justification for that time?

Re: Around 30 percent of children in the U.S. don't get enough sleep: study

#73

Post by tonyedgecombe »

baron816 wrote: post #57
astura wrote: post #45

Kids need a more sleep than adults, sometimes a lot more sleep. I don't think adults realize this sometimes, and kids can silently suffer as a result (and not even really understand they are suffering). It absolutely amazes me when I see young children out and about late at night because I had a very strict early bedtime as a child - 8pm early in life, 9pm starting my tween years. It was very much to my disdain at th…

Falling asleep that early is unnatural and very difficult at that age. I recall many nights trying to go to sleep early and lying in bed, stressing about not being able to sleep (making it even harder to sleep).

I had the same regimen and don’t remember having problems with it. It wasn’t until my mid teens that I shifted to later times.

Re: Around 30 percent of children in the U.S. don't get enough sleep: study

#74

Post by aliceryhl »

cco wrote: post #61
casion wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think this is true. When I was younger, I only could fall asleep at ~2am. I went to multiple schools with starting times varying from 5am to 12pm, it never made a difference. I just wasn't tired until 2am no matter what.

Did you use artificial light anytime after the sun went down?

Is your whole house a big window? Where I'm from we always have light inside

Re: Around 30 percent of children in the U.S. don't get enough sleep: study

#75

Post by hwillis »

zeta0134 wrote: post #58
EpicEng wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>We wake up students too early I agree, but... you were staying up until 1-2am playing video games. C'mon.

I also stayed up until 1-2am, regularly, starting around junior high. I performed a great many tasks, mostly teaching myself various programming languages, always at the relative expense of my concentration in the next day's classes. Two things were the primary motivating factors in developing this habit: - My parents wouldn't leave me alone for very long in the evenings, so I felt like I wouldn't get a chance to rea…

> My brain gets tired around 10pm like a normal person, but then it gets a "second wind" and is up happily until 3-4am, with intensely increased clarity of focus.

Not saying this isn't your natural predisposition, but FWIW this is pretty much exactly what happens to everyone with a disrupted sleep schedule. Or any disrupted normal cycle, really[1]. Probably the large majority of people have experienced this.

[1]: Fasting is one example- you will be starving by lunch or dinner, but if you wait a few hours longer the hunger will go away pretty much entirely. You may feel sluggish and slow when you're hungry, but once your brain realizes you aren't going to eat you will feel lighter and more energetic. If your body needs to go past its normal cycles, your brain will give you the resources to do so. The hunger and tiredness you feel normally are more like periodic maintenance reminders.

Re: Around 30 percent of children in the U.S. don't get enough sleep: study

#76

Post by yblubbery »

EpicEng wrote: post #33
webkike wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

how is this any different from a chess club of a sports club? Seriously, all of those clubs demand many hours of dedication. If you do a sport in highschool you basically have to be able to get 4 hours of sleep and deal with it

We could argue the merits of paying video games against something like chess club, but that's not the argument I'm making. I'm only saying that, if you stay up until 1-2am, you're going to have a hard time pretty much anywhere unless they let you roll in at 10. For my part, I still play video games, slept through most of school, got kicked out, taught myself to program at 22, and have been working in the field for 14…

learn to program -> get job instantly

Re: Around 30 percent of children in the U.S. don't get enough sleep: study

#77

Post by matwood »

zeta0134 wrote: post #58
EpicEng wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>We wake up students too early I agree, but... you were staying up until 1-2am playing video games. C'mon.

I also stayed up until 1-2am, regularly, starting around junior high. I performed a great many tasks, mostly teaching myself various programming languages, always at the relative expense of my concentration in the next day's classes. Two things were the primary motivating factors in developing this habit: - My parents wouldn't leave me alone for very long in the evenings, so I felt like I wouldn't get a chance to rea…

> I get my best work done in the evenings, and so do lots of other people.

Have you ever tried shifting to mornings? I used to think as you and started getting up early (and going to bed earlier), and was much more productive. My focus in particular was much higher because there so much fewer distractions.

Not saying this is you, but I had an old boss who thought he did his best work at night. Except, I had to come in every morning and fix all the bugs he introduced during his late night coding sessions. Being tired made him think he was making better decisions than he was which is inline with the adage that driving tired is like driving under the influence.

Re: Around 30 percent of children in the U.S. don't get enough sleep: study

#78

Post by kortex »

masonic wrote: post #22
sjg007 wrote: post #11

Adolescents are natural night owls. It's probably in our genetics.

It's probably in our genetics It's never been reported in pre-industrial societies or even presently in areas where artificial light well into the night is uncommon.

That does not factor in genetic predisposition to sensitivity to the circadian stimulating effects of blue light.

Some people aren't much affected by screen time at night, and some people can readily get up before dawn. I for one have to be very careful to limit my exposure at night, and waking up before sunrise (artificial or natural) is excruciating. I have been diagnosed with DPSD. I vastly prefer to go to bed and wake up later than average

Re: Around 30 percent of children in the U.S. don't get enough sleep: study

#79

Post by matwood »

jay_kyburz wrote: post #65
wrktanice wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> teens don’t stay up because they are playing Starcraft. They play Starcraft because they are up. This is, at least in my experience, completely untrue. When I play Starcraft, I'll easily play till 2-3 am before I start feeling tired. And I'd continue playing, but I'm literally succumbing to exhaustion at that point. If I force myself to before that, say midnight, I start feeling tired almost immediately. And if I d…

Yeah, I'm nearly 50, and I never start a new game of anything after 9 because it wakes me up to much, I can easily find myself still playing and not tired at all after midnight. I need at least an hour of winding down after gaming before bed.

Back when I played MMOs (DAoC and WoW) I thought I was a night person. When I finally quit those games, I realized I wasn't a night person at all. I had just been forcing myself awake. Not only did I start going to be earlier, but sleep came much easier.

Re: Around 30 percent of children in the U.S. don't get enough sleep: study

#80

Post by matwood »

EpicEng wrote: post #33
webkike wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

how is this any different from a chess club of a sports club? Seriously, all of those clubs demand many hours of dedication. If you do a sport in highschool you basically have to be able to get 4 hours of sleep and deal with it

We could argue the merits of paying video games against something like chess club, but that's not the argument I'm making. I'm only saying that, if you stay up until 1-2am, you're going to have a hard time pretty much anywhere unless they let you roll in at 10. For my part, I still play video games, slept through most of school, got kicked out, taught myself to program at 22, and have been working in the field for 14…

I agree with you. Move start time to 10 and people will stay up until 3-4. The underlying point is people are trying to find extra time in their day to do with as they please.
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