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Gmail marking email from me as spam

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Re: Gmail marking email from me as spam

#381

Post by dghughes »

cnst wrote: post #334
dghughes wrote: post #250

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not sure about OP but to me rules in GMail don't work. Gmail filters don't seem to work anymore. I had filters and labels and it was great but I noticed they seems to be failing. If you go down the rabbit hole of Google Gmail support you'll find filters don't apply to email ("conversations") already in your inbox. But they also don't seem to apply to new email. Asking on various groups people seem to be giving instru…

I think they change the way it works, and then existing filters may break at one point. I've had this happen to several filters. TBH, it's just easier to re-do the filters. There's also an option to make it apply to old conversations on a one-time basis as well.

I've tried that without success. Delete all rules/filters, labels and re-create it all again. Nothing will work on old or new messages. And "apply to zero conversations" is the only thing I see that seems like it would be it but the zero part means no chance of working.

Gmail even replied to me on Twitter saying the filters no longer work.

Screenshot of Gmail reply on twitter https://i.imgur.com/URhBeXn.png

I like using filters I don't see why such an important email tool is so awkward to use on Gmail.

Re: Gmail marking email from me as spam

#382

Post by anonygler »

sdan wrote: post #8

Google's making us play by their rules: 1. Our ML models see that your emails spam? You're spam. 2. You're using Tor or a VPN? Here's 10 reCaptcha's. 3. Don't use Google Webmaster or use AMPs? Good luck finding your page on the 1st page. 4. Youtube video includes education hacking tutorials? Demonetized. Obviously some alternatives are moving to Fastmail and using Duck Duck Go, but we need Google to stop this "my way…

I mean, I get captcha's all the time while working from Google's network. You're exhausting from a shared quota. That's life on the modern internet.

Bitch about Google all you want, it's not like they decided this is how the internet should work. Prior to Google, my company integrated with reCaptcha because no other choice existed to reduce automated abuse.

Re: Gmail marking email from me as spam

#383

Post by Avamander »

baobabKoodaa wrote: post #379
Avamander wrote: post #275

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think it's magic, but okay, I don't have a reasonable way without doxing myself to have you test it out yourself.

There's plenty of low effort ways you could provide proof while maintaining relative anonymity (if you actually wanted to support your claims with evidence). For example, you can run a GlockApps test (5 minutes, free) and then take a screenshot of the results with identifying information blanked out.

Because OP talked about Google not allowing small players to send e-mail here's my server's deliverability results to Google: https://i.imgur.com/sceZogI.png

If you're wondering about the blacklist number, that's an error - the source site claims it knows nothing.

Re: Gmail marking email from me as spam

#384

Post by perl4ever »

dageshi wrote: post #195
LeonM wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Rarely have I seen such concise and respectful way of describing the typical rants I see on HN way to often, bravo! I can only wish I had your writing skills. > It's insulting to the folks that are pouring their time replying to what they think is a user in need of technical assistance, only to eventually stop replying when it becomes obvious that he only replies with questions of morality and treats most answers as…

This is essentially HN with every single Google related post nowadays. Good or bad, people hate Google, they hate it the way they used to hate Microsoft, they see everything it does as being nefarious. People ignore the email spammers, SEO spammers, automated password crackers and blame google for the solutions they put in place to combat those things. It's impossible to reason with them, honestly I think it's just b…

"People irrationally hate X" may be perfectly true, but is not a reason why any particular, or most, or the most significant, criticisms of X are wrong or should be ignored.

Even the particular people who irrationally hate something are obviously likely to also run across the good reasons for hating it.

It's not reasonable to say "criticism X doesn't count anymore because we've heard it too many times".

Re: Gmail marking email from me as spam

#385

Post by megous »

cnst wrote: post #343
megous wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It doesn't really matter if he or the gmail user initiates the conversation, in my experience. Probably the only reliable way to communicate with gmail users is to send them 5xx response right away when they first contact you, and inform them there about the situation, and that they should check spam and why, tell them to resend, and let the other messages from the same gmail address through (maybe repeat this from t…

This is actually a great idea. We should implement this two-step approach for anyone trying to email us from Gmail. Sadly, I'd imagine some users don't really have a choice, e.g., an employee whose company is using Gmail from G Suite for its email, so, it'd be an uphill battle for sure.

Maybe, one other thing where this would have to have a shortcircuited is when I initiate the contact, so that people responding would not get hit by this, even if their reply is the first e-mail from them sent to my server. So it should be fairly smart.

Re: Gmail marking email from me as spam

#386

Post by megous »

lonelappde wrote: post #359
megous wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It doesn't really matter if he or the gmail user initiates the conversation, in my experience. Probably the only reliable way to communicate with gmail users is to send them 5xx response right away when they first contact you, and inform them there about the situation, and that they should check spam and why, tell them to resend, and let the other messages from the same gmail address through (maybe repeat this from t…

You could try that. But I'm not sure so many people would think that corresponding with you is worth the trouble.

I can't really care less about those people. Most people I'm talking about are people who're contacting me because I already provided them quite a bit of free service via my free software.

So if someone can't be bothered to check so that I'm not wasting time responding to their trash folder, that's a good filter in the first place.

Anyway, better thing might be responding by adding a (F)AQ item publicly, and just sending a link.

Re: Gmail marking email from me as spam

#387

Post by natch »

mav3rick wrote: post #370
natch wrote: post #362

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Solving it perfectly is very hard, you are right on that. But solving it better than Google has? Not hard at all. A high school programming class could do it better. Unlike other parts of Google, which are doing amazing things like beating human masters at Go, something is seriously fishy in the spam filter tool department.

If it was this easy, please write your own ?

What a facile response. First, I said it would be hard, not easy. More importantly it would be pointless since Google controls which system they choose to use and their choice is clearly not driven by quality, but by something else.

Re: Gmail marking email from me as spam

#388

Post by craftinator »

vbezhenar wrote: post #330
irjustin wrote: post #79

I would argue in this narrow case - I would not point to nefarious undercurrents. Google's ML mail spam models are that way because there's too many bad actors. Email, even in 2019, still extremely valuable. If you can get into people's email inbox, there's still quite high conversion rate - better than clicks/videos on a pure percentage basis. Even the author wants to reach out to people in a cold fashion. As a gmai…

> As a gmail user, I 100% appreciate keeping my inbox extremely clean. Google's spam filter is a welcome addition. Not the case for me. I'm okay with some spam. It's not hard for me to delete few mails every day. But I'm extremely not okay with legitimate mail marked as spam. And gmail keep doing that. And that means that I must check spam daily. So basically gmail spam filtering does not exist for me, because I stil…

This is exactly the viewpoint I have as well. I have missed some very important emails before, such as instructions for an interview, acceptance emails, etc... They don't even show up in Gmail's search system, because it doesn't search through spam. This has forced me to look through all of the spam I get daily, examining each one to make sure I'm not missing something important. Gmail may as well not filter spam at this point.

Re: Gmail marking email from me as spam

#389

Post by seventhtiger »

loup-vaillant wrote: post #335
xxs wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>2. You're using Tor or a VPN? Here's 10 reCaptcha's. I get recapthca ALL the time for just not being logged on and deleting all filthy cookies on exit; and not "honoring" 3rd party cookies at all... and I don't care. Best part is that if you live in a country you don't speak the language you get google services in one of the country official languages -- so what you should do and mark is often unclear. The next best…

> (edit adding "?hl=en" to the url tends to fix the issue in most of google services) Seriously, you shouldn't have to. Your browser sends language preferences, doesn't it? Nope, IP trumps user preferences. Had the same problem when using my job's VPN with an exit point in Germany (working from France). Very annoying.

Google also forces certain countries to use Hijri calendar with no option to switch to Gregorian.

Even if your language is English and your calendar is Gregorian, it will still display news dated in Hijri. No setting or option to change.

Re: Gmail marking email from me as spam

#390

Post by neop1x »

I think the major problem here is IP reputation. Especially if you are hosting on public VPS or worse your home network. The root of the problem is spam abuse. Spammers have no problem to spin up random VPS to send spam. They can set rDNS, SPF, DMARC too. There is enormous amount of spam. Of course it should be handled on message-by-message basis, using proper antispam and ML. But it looks like some providers simply block various IP prefixes. :( It makes their work easier and it is marketing to use their services "which work".
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