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Men View Their Ex-Partners More Favorably Than Women Do: Study

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Re: Men View Their Ex-Partners More Favorably Than Women Do: Study

#181

Post by tomschlick »

shantly wrote: post #169
tomschlick wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be fair, until recently almost everyone considered gender to be a synonym for sex. Now people are taking "gender identity" and shortening it to be gender and taking exception to people using the synonym as we always have.

I saw the shift to "gender" as the social side of sex way before I ever heard or read the term "gender identity". Though maybe that is what happened and "gender identity" was just very, very niche at the time (like, 25 years ago, probably) such that its descendent term "gender" outran it, so to speak. However, I got the impression that the distinction between "gender" and "sex" predated my encounter of it by decades.…

Yeah the shift for social psychologists probably happened 25ish years ago. Though, I'd argue up until 5 or so years ago if you asked the average person the majority would tell you gender == sex. Even today I'd guess close to half couldn't tell you the defined difference between the two.

Re: Men View Their Ex-Partners More Favorably Than Women Do: Study

#182

Post by olawd »

moate wrote: post #109
xky wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why?

From a sociological standpoint: Because you're doing bad social science. When you're talking about values/cultures, those things are inherently rooted in a culture. Saying "all men X" is almost entirely useless because there's almost always going to be a culture or subculture that makes it "most men" instead. This specific article was based off a study conducted in Austria with mean ages of men/women involved in thei…

Muh blank slate

Re: Men View Their Ex-Partners More Favorably Than Women Do: Study

#183

Post by datashow »

hacknat wrote: post #60

Social Psychology has one of the worst reproducibility problems in all of academia. Claims like this make is easy to see why. Simple scientific inquiry into this claim leads me to the question, “Okay, but why? That women potentially harbor worse feelings of their ex partners on average than men is one of the most interesting but useless things I’ve heard. The confounding explanations for this type of research are min…

"Social Psychology has one of the worst reproducibility problems in all of academia."

Not to be defending social psychology in any way, but I have to point out this assessment is seriously misled. Social psychology gets bad impression on reproducibility, because there are tons of research on the reproducibility of social psychology studies. The statement makes it sound like there are reproducibility examinations across all fields in academia. In reality, it is rare. Most fields in academia do not get this kind of examination at all.

Also, reproducibility examinations mostly are focused on experimental research. However, this study is observational research, which is a totally different kind of social science study.

Re: Men View Their Ex-Partners More Favorably Than Women Do: Study

#184

Post by reroute1 »

k__ wrote: post #179
reroute1 wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Getting one side of the story is not getting the whole story.

I know, most of the time the side I was getting was the side of the story my male friends told me. But for the last 5-10 years I also got the side of my female partners. Sometimes even both sides in parallel, because my partners would date my friends.

OK so you have no more information than anyone else? We all have friends who talk about relationships and its all anecdata. Not to mention you have a very specific group of open and non-standard people which could give a very different selection of behaviors than the normal population.

Re: Men View Their Ex-Partners More Favorably Than Women Do: Study

#185

Post by K0SM0S »

dahart wrote: post #147
hacknat wrote: post #60

Social Psychology has one of the worst reproducibility problems in all of academia. Claims like this make is easy to see why. Simple scientific inquiry into this claim leads me to the question, “Okay, but why? That women potentially harbor worse feelings of their ex partners on average than men is one of the most interesting but useless things I’ve heard. The confounding explanations for this type of research are min…

> The confounding explanations for this type of research are mind boggling. Yes! This is very true, your questions are good questions to ask of any study of genders & attitudes. It’s even more important to ask of studies that try to factor out cultural issues, because confounding explanations are extremely difficult to remove. > Social Psychology has one of the worst reproducibility problems in all of academia. This…

Just a few remarks, notwithstanding your/my opinions.

Physics has not "one of the better reproducibility rates" but 100%; per the Scientific Method any valid theory must:

- be reproducible (verifiable empirically)

- have predictive power

- not negate existing theories

This constitutes 'acceptable proof'.

It yields a 'compound effect' to theoretical research: for instance, Newton's Laws were never wrong, just narrower in scope than Einstein's. No future valid theory will ever prove any of these two wrong, it can only generalize more, because we know these two to be true. True is true forever, barring a fundamental change in this universe itself. So we keep the theoretical foundations forever, they're solid.

Their interpretation, however, may change as we widen the scope, and that is the 'human' part in science, the art of it, to produce valid representations linking the math with the experience of reality. That changes a lot, in time, and even from person to person.

The 'why' things are is another matter entirely and not a concern for physics nor science in general; we search for the root causes to explain 'how' things work the way they do. We stop there in theory for beyond is mere interpretation, opinion, belief.

Now this would exclude all social sciences and biology and countless others from the realm of 'science' and that's not fair; these fields yield very usable results despite the nigh impossible search for pure theory. I like the 19-20th century view that 'empirical sciences' gain value when we try to the best of our ability to apply the Scientific Method and mathematical tools to account for fuzziness.

Deep learning is certainly a formidable upgrade to the tooling of empirical sciences, brute-forcing 'how' things work for lack of a better truth than retrospective.

Just don't compare it to e.g. physics, don't ask for predictability (as you wouldn't ask a fish to fly), it's pointless and only serves to undermine the value of empirical sciences, while overemphasizing that of theory.

Because you know, in theory, practice and theory are the same, but in practice they're not... ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Re: Men View Their Ex-Partners More Favorably Than Women Do: Study

#186

Post by TallGuyShort »

input_sh wrote: post #172
TallGuyShort wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't understand how someone can simply adopt stereotypes of another gender, consider themselves that gender, and then be considered that gender. If I'm a man according to my chromosomes, but my mannerisms, grooming, music and fashion choices are considered feminine, am I woman? Or just a feminine man? And if I'm a woman, but I'm still attracted to other women, am I entitled to represent myself as a lesbian? All I'…

> The only thing left is what label I want to put on myself, which is largely meaningless. That's... that's the point. I'll refer to you however you want to be referred (inb4 helicopter joke). There's nothing more to it. Just accept other people's preference and move on with your day. It's that simple.

I'm fine with that day-to-day. Has literally never been a problem for me. But when it's affirmative action, sports divisions, or in this case, people discussing if a study is reflecting biological sex differences or things people choose to express in a study, yeah let's be really fucking clear that someone is choosing to express social stereotypes and that's not always the same thing as "being a woman".

Re: Men View Their Ex-Partners More Favorably Than Women Do: Study

#187

Post by shantly »

tomschlick wrote: post #181
shantly wrote: post #169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I saw the shift to "gender" as the social side of sex way before I ever heard or read the term "gender identity". Though maybe that is what happened and "gender identity" was just very, very niche at the time (like, 25 years ago, probably) such that its descendent term "gender" outran it, so to speak. However, I got the impression that the distinction between "gender" and "sex" predated my encounter of it by decades.…

Yeah the shift for social psychologists probably happened 25ish years ago. Though, I'd argue up until 5 or so years ago if you asked the average person the majority would tell you gender == sex. Even today I'd guess close to half couldn't tell you the defined difference between the two.

> Even today I'd guess close to half couldn't tell you the defined difference between the two.

I kinda halfway try to follow this stuff, and honestly, I'd have trouble defining most of the terms involved in a way that didn't step on someone's toes—and I'd be trying not to! No wonder people are put off by it.

Re: Men View Their Ex-Partners More Favorably Than Women Do: Study

#188

Post by zwieback »

hacknat wrote: post #60

Social Psychology has one of the worst reproducibility problems in all of academia. Claims like this make is easy to see why. Simple scientific inquiry into this claim leads me to the question, “Okay, but why? That women potentially harbor worse feelings of their ex partners on average than men is one of the most interesting but useless things I’ve heard. The confounding explanations for this type of research are min…

Reproducibility is terrible in this field but for this particular study they explain their statistical methods as well as provide links to the data. You could do your own analysis if you wish.

The recruits were found via email in an Austrian University so I don't think the authors would make any cross-cultural claims.

Re: Men View Their Ex-Partners More Favorably Than Women Do: Study

#189

Post by smt88 »

myrandomcomment wrote: post #151

I love my wife completely. She is perfect for me. I cannot see my life without her. When I travel for work, everyday I am away I miss her and she is never far from my mind. We have been together for 20 years. There was a whole set of women before her. There was one for 5 years. The other day it was her (5 year relationship) birthday and I remembered randomly after noticing the date and dropped her a short note wishin…

I think this is the danger of social science. Everyone has anecdata, and you tend to believe (and share) the studies that support your anecdata.

> time that removes any negative view?

I was taught in college psychology that most people start to forget the negative aspects of relationships and cling to the good aspects.

A quick Google search suggests I was misinformed, though: https://www.google.com/search?q=humans+forget+negative+thing...

Re: Men View Their Ex-Partners More Favorably Than Women Do: Study

#190

Post by lightbyte »

rpmisms wrote: post #162
dahart wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The parent is completely correct, why are you fighting it? This isn’t something you can out-logic, the words have definitions. Sex is the biological part and gender is the social & cultural aspects of sex.

According to Merriam-Webster, gender /includes/ the social & cultural aspects of sex. The exclusion of sex from gender is an extremely recent development that isn't widely accepted yet. Also, motherhood and fatherhood are biologically gender-linked roles. They are measurable biological phenomena that tie strongly into your definition of gender.

>The exclusion of sex from gender is an extremely recent development that isn't widely accepted yet.

This is not an extremely recent development in the slightest, the distinction was being made almost 60 years ago in modern dictionaries.

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