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Working asynchronously

blog.remote.com

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Re: Working asynchronously

#81

Post by wisty »

alexandercrohde wrote: post #58
tonyarkles wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is tongue firmly in cheek, but I think it really drives home your "Communication is hard" point. Have you tried reading the meeting agenda and minutes the average engineering manager makes? It's like a freshman essay -- lacking in cohesion, vision, context. It's usually completely unstandardized across teams. And 9 times out of 10 the most fundamental questions aren't answered in the meetings e.g. "Why don't we…

Yeah, but the point is, I can ask all of those questions in the meeting if I'm there in person.

You could also read documentation and ask questions about it. And unlike meetings, everyone won't just forget the answer and have to have the discussion next week.

Re: Working asynchronously

#82

Post by pacaro »

bloopernova wrote: post #35
pacaro wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is exactly where writing docs epitomises Larry Wall's "laziness" virtue. http://threevirtues.com/

A lot of my "formative years" in IT were spent in several Perl environments, but it's been a while since I heard those 3 virtues so succinctly put. Thank you :)

Thank whoever put the website up!

The text is pulled verbatim from the camel book[1].

I somehow assume that "everyone" has used or had access to a well thumbed copy of the camel book, but realize that it's a product of place and time

[1] Programming Perl https://g.co/kgs/ZnNHTJ

Re: Working asynchronously

#83

Post by jerf »

serpix wrote: post #75
jerf wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"I always hated "15 minutes of real-time conversation", not because of being an introvert or anything, but because it's fuzzy, nobody remembers what it was exactly said, and usually ends up with people wasting each others time (like Diltert-style meetings)." I'd say the solution is to attack those problems directly. There are some things that just work poorly asynchronously. I find heavy-duty explanations of somethin…

4 managers to one dev is a ratio that warrants a very quick change of jobs.

No, I mean, some sort of cross-team functionality where you need broad agreement, not four managers all trying to manage literally the same thing.

I probably do more cross-team stuff than the average dev, but in anything beyond a trivially-sized organization, managers are doing it all the time.

Re: Working asynchronously

#84

Post by cbm-vic-20 »

omarhaneef wrote: post #22
jsharf wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not the same person, but I have a small notebook and pen. Any time I think "Shit, how am I going to remember this if I get interrupted right now?", I quickly scribble down as much as I can and continue working. This is invaluable when I do get interrupted. I do this basically any time I feel like my short-term memory is overwhelmed with facts, and as a result the notebook has effectively become NVRAM for my brain…

This is the closest to what I do myself -- I always have pen and paper on my desk -- but the real issue is that I don't take a note when interrupted because of social pressures (its rude to ignore someone for a few seconds). I don't even do it for myself for self interruptions because I forget to.

It's rude to interrupt someone without giving them the time to put down whatever it is they're doing. Even if it takes more than a few seconds.

Re: Working asynchronously

#85

Post by bregma »

I spend several years managing an all-remote team that ranged from Perth WA to Seattle WA. We worked 90% pure asynchronously and 10% using video chat (or physical get-togethers from time to time). It was highly productive, and because it was all open source development any lack of productivity would have been obvious.

I now commute to an office where we all work asynchronously but are expected to appear to work synchronously, as is traditionally expected. It is less enjoyable, frequently subject to context switches (you need to synchronize with the dominant worker) and certainly no more productive -- although that's hard to tell since everything is secret and need-to-know.

I would say working asynchronously is better for intellectual workers. Most intellectual work places that claim to working syncronously are either working under an illusion or under a bad manager with a "my synchrony" attitude.

Re: Working asynchronously

#86

Post by albertzeyer »

PragmaticPulp wrote: post #9

I've managed multiple remote, asynchronous teams across multiple countries. When people work in opposite time zones, asynchronous communication is mandatory. When it works, it's a great experience. However, async communication isn't appropriate for every situation, as the article admits. Some times, the most efficient way forward is to schedule a call where all parties can work out the solution in 15 minutes of real-…

How exactly would you identify such a situation when a real-time conversation is more productive? And do you think that everyone involved agrees in the same way on this?

It would be interesting to analyse such situations further, and maybe there are actually ways to resolve it in a more productive and efficient way which does not require real-time conversation.

Re: Working asynchronously

#87

Post by organsnyder »

coldtea wrote: post #38
PragmaticPulp wrote: post #9

I've managed multiple remote, asynchronous teams across multiple countries. When people work in opposite time zones, asynchronous communication is mandatory. When it works, it's a great experience. However, async communication isn't appropriate for every situation, as the article admits. Some times, the most efficient way forward is to schedule a call where all parties can work out the solution in 15 minutes of real-…

> When it works, it's a great experience. However, async communication isn't appropriate for every situation, as the article admits. Some times, the most efficient way forward is to schedule a call where all parties can work out the solution in 15 minutes of real-time conversation rather than 3 days of back-and-forth e-mails. I always hated "15 minutes of real-time conversation", not because of being an introvert or…

I actually enjoy real-time meetings, as long as a few conditions are met:

1. A concise, realistic agenda is distributed to all attendees beforehand, and actually followed 2. A single person takes concise notes, with a heavy focus on action items and official decisions; the notes are distributed promptly at the end of the meeting (or better yet, real-time via a shared document) 3. Each action item is given a single assignee and realistic deadline

Your chat example seems like it could be solved with a 5-minute screenshare.

Re: Working asynchronously

#88

Post by DoreenMichele »

coldtea wrote: post #38
PragmaticPulp wrote: post #9

I've managed multiple remote, asynchronous teams across multiple countries. When people work in opposite time zones, asynchronous communication is mandatory. When it works, it's a great experience. However, async communication isn't appropriate for every situation, as the article admits. Some times, the most efficient way forward is to schedule a call where all parties can work out the solution in 15 minutes of real-…

> When it works, it's a great experience. However, async communication isn't appropriate for every situation, as the article admits. Some times, the most efficient way forward is to schedule a call where all parties can work out the solution in 15 minutes of real-time conversation rather than 3 days of back-and-forth e-mails. I always hated "15 minutes of real-time conversation", not because of being an introvert or…

Many years ago, I did some volunteer work at a homeless shelter. The second highest person there was not tech savvy but had to fill out a lot of their paperwork.

She once thought she had "lost" her entire spreadsheet because she scrolled too far down to a blank section of the spreadsheet.

Re: Working asynchronously

#89

Post by xxpor »

sergiotapia wrote: post #66
xxpor wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Companies have actually done that, and it's worse: They're the "homework" interviews.

I'm hiring for our team. All of the feedback I've gotten from candidate was that it's fantastic because of the take home interview. No need to sweat and tremble over whiteboard questions. Do you prefer those?

As a practical matter, I'd probably prefer a take home assignment OVER an in person interview. However, doing both would be a non-starter, that's too much work.

Re: Working asynchronously

#90

Post by kelnos »

omarhaneef wrote: post #22
jsharf wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not the same person, but I have a small notebook and pen. Any time I think "Shit, how am I going to remember this if I get interrupted right now?", I quickly scribble down as much as I can and continue working. This is invaluable when I do get interrupted. I do this basically any time I feel like my short-term memory is overwhelmed with facts, and as a result the notebook has effectively become NVRAM for my brain…

This is the closest to what I do myself -- I always have pen and paper on my desk -- but the real issue is that I don't take a note when interrupted because of social pressures (its rude to ignore someone for a few seconds). I don't even do it for myself for self interruptions because I forget to.

That problem is solved through humility and social graces.

"Hold on a sec, I just wanna write down what I was doing so I don't lose my place."

If you want to add more, after writing it down, you can follow up with, "sorry to keep you waiting, but when I get interrupted I often forget some useful details about what I was working on, and I want to get that down before it leaves my head".

(The "when I get interrupted" is a bit of a cheeky way to point out "you are imposing on me, so the least you can do is allow me this".)

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