It’s pretty much guaranteed that the next generation will grow up with the experience of always watched. Either they get watched by the parents who never let them do anything alone or by technology. Pretty sad in my view but almost inevitable.
Under digital surveillance: how American schools spy on millions of kids
21–30 of 104 posts
Re: Under digital surveillance: how American schools spy on millions of kids
#22It starts with looking for suicide and potential violence but where does it go from here? Sexual activity? Discussing the Quran? Talking about teachers and administrators you don't like? Political views not shared with the district?
If a kid gets in trouble do you analyze their entire history and punish them for potentially deviant discussions? Who may search a child's history? What are the repercussions for misusing the information?
These programs start with the best intentions but will effect their willingness to communicate openly without first filtering their thoughts through the 'acceptable thoughts' police. Who really knows how this will change a generation of students?
Re: Under digital surveillance: how American schools spy on millions of kids
#23As long as it's limited to school devices and school email/chat, I don't see the problem. Maybe it's just me, but my dad instilled in me early on that anything I do on the internet is there permanently for anyone who cares enough to see. The problem arises from immediate action on the part of the administrators, stemming from zero-tolerance policies that are usually present. Exercising restraint with respect to these…
> The problem arises from immediate action on the part of the administrators, stemming from zero-tolerance policies [...] Exercising restraint with respect to these tools would lead to better outcomes, in my opinion. In fairness, there are a lot of laws out there that compel teachers, administrators, and school resource officers to take certain disciplinary actions without regard to their personal feelings on the mat…
> ... so what can the judge really do?
Overrule the law, declare it unjust, be the balance to the legislative branch. Yeah, that comes with the possibility of appeals and having another judge change the ruling. But that's how the system should work.
You're absolutely right about school employees, though - they're required to act lest their lack of action affect their careers. What needs to change is that the accused student needs the same rights an adult would have: the right to have your day in "court" with the possibility that the decision is 'not guilty.'
Re: Under digital surveillance: how American schools spy on millions of kids
#24Earlier quoted context omitted.
in general, you are responsible for whatever is done with your account/machine, authorized or not. if you are doing even the bare minimum to secure the computer, you should not be vulnerable to these kind of pranks from siblings/classmates. if it's unreasonable to expect a child to clear this bar, then they are not yet responsible enough to be entrusted with their own computing device.
> in general, you are responsible for whatever is done with your account/machine, authorized or not. if you are doing even the bare minimum to secure the computer, you should not be vulnerable to these kind of pranks from siblings/classmates. This makes sense in a corporate or military environment, but is simply not reasonable for home use. You're claiming that one can never allow anyone else to have unsupervised phy…
I should have been more clear. I'm not talking about sophisticated adversaries performing hardware attacks on a middle school student's laptop. I'm talking about the very basic steps necessary to prevent your brother from googling for porn on your school computer. in the vast majority of cases, having a good password and logging out of the computer when you're finished will prevent these kinds of pranks. if the child can't handle this, they are not ready for their own computer.
Re: Under digital surveillance: how American schools spy on millions of kids
#25Earlier quoted context omitted.
in general, you are responsible for whatever is done with your account/machine, authorized or not. if you are doing even the bare minimum to secure the computer, you should not be vulnerable to these kind of pranks from siblings/classmates. if it's unreasonable to expect a child to clear this bar, then they are not yet responsible enough to be entrusted with their own computing device.
That's not been true for almost every device I can think of other than firearms/explosives. If someone steals your car and crashes it are you responsible? If not why are computers different?
when a computer is provided to you by an organization, you are usually obligated to take reasonable steps to prevent its misuse and especially to prevent misuse of your credentials. do you really disagree that this is the case?
Re: Under digital surveillance: how American schools spy on millions of kids
#26It’s pretty much guaranteed that the next generation will grow up with the experience of always watched. Either they get watched by the parents who never let them do anything alone or by technology. Pretty sad in my view but almost inevitable.
As someone raised by helicopter parents that were way ahead of their time, this has been kind of nice for me.
It's pretty amusing to me that I used to be the weird one connected to the internet all the time because I pretty much couldn't do anything else, and now that's a shared experience with the entire new generation.
Re: Under digital surveillance: how American schools spy on millions of kids
#27A while back in Texas my wife and I got a lovely call from one of our children's school counselors because our child's search history the previous evening, on their school issued chrome laptop, had included a search for symptoms of cyanide poisoning which apparently triggered one of the systems used to detect those sorts of things. It turns out that the search was related to a homework assignment for a book they had been reading...
Re: Under digital surveillance: how American schools spy on millions of kids
#28Earlier quoted context omitted.
In a perverted sense, this is an opportunity to teach the children a very important lesson: if you're using a machine or network owned and operated by your employer (or, by extension, your school), then you should be scrupulous about only using it for work (or school) business.
Very firm agree. These devices were school owned, and technically "government" owned property. They were not handed out to the students to use however they pleased. They were to be utilized for digital text books, curriculum, and ancillary education resources that were designed by the teachers and administrators of the district. We locked the devices down so that student's couldn't get to certain kinds of apps, parts…
Why should we just give public schools a pass for providing kids with email addresses and other adult technologies that have no real educational value?
Giving devices to kids is not saving on educational costs, and it's not making their backpacks any lighter. Books don't require tech support lines, chat bots, or surveillance tech to keep it all humming smoothly.
But worse of all, it's totally outside the proper purview of our education systems. Public schools don't implement, monitor, and protect a new mailbox on every student's property just for school-related mail delivery. Why should they be giving kids email addresses and expecting them to use those addresses?
School-issued Apple IDs? I cannot be the only one who reads that with extreme disgust and concern.
Re: Under digital surveillance: how American schools spy on millions of kids
#29Earlier quoted context omitted.
That's not been true for almost every device I can think of other than firearms/explosives. If someone steals your car and crashes it are you responsible? If not why are computers different?
when a computer is provided to you by an organization, you are usually obligated to take reasonable steps to prevent its misuse and especially to prevent misuse of your credentials. do you really disagree that this is the case?
Does reasonable steps imply "prevent all bad actors in all cases"?
Are the users expected to store their machines in fort Knox under armed guard?
>if you are doing even the bare minimum to secure the computer, you should not be vulnerable to these kind of pranks from siblings/classmates.
This is a statement that reads to me like "implementation is left as an exercise for the reader" type proclamation of how easy it is to secure things. Followed up with a snide remark about children not being ready for the machines.
Adults are constantly getting their machines compromised so it really seems like you're just applying a greater standard to people with less experience
Re: Under digital surveillance: how American schools spy on millions of kids
#30Earlier quoted context omitted.
That's not been true for almost every device I can think of other than firearms/explosives. If someone steals your car and crashes it are you responsible? If not why are computers different?
when a computer is provided to you by an organization, you are usually obligated to take reasonable steps to prevent its misuse and especially to prevent misuse of your credentials. do you really disagree that this is the case?
What part about stolen don't you understand? People take reasonable steps to secure their cars, because it's financially painful, but it still happens!