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To hire neurodiverse workers, one firm got rid of job interviews

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Re: To hire neurodiverse workers, one firm got rid of job interviews

#281

Post by reubeniv »

shantly wrote: post #6

> Terms like these – or interview questions such as ‘where you see yourself in five years’ – can be too general for people with autism, as many with the condition can find vague questions particularly hard to decipher. Pretty sure it's not just autistic folks who have to have prepped & memorized some bullshit in advance to have any kind of "acceptable" answer to those sorts of questions. Not to take away from the bro…

the douchebag one is a strange one unless you're going for management :/ where do you see yourself in 5 years though seems a reasonable question; do you want to lead a team, be certified in something, gain experience in x, etc, just pick a career goal from the hat surely

Re: To hire neurodiverse workers, one firm got rid of job interviews

#282

Post by RobertRoberts »

Nasrudith wrote: post #277
RobertRoberts wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Weird may be a simple emotional feeling people get because they sense you will mistreat them. (likely based on previous experience) What I have found dealing with people that are Aspie/ADD (father and brother) is they expect others to change behavior to adapt to themselves, but refuse to change their own behavior to adapt to others. (even when directly told their behavior is not acceptable) This means that many socia…

> Weird may be a simple emotional feeling people get because they sense you will mistreat them. (likely based on previous experience) What I have found dealing with people that are Aspie/ADD (father and brother) is they expect others to change behavior to adapt to themselves, but refuse to change their own behavior to adapt to others. (even when directly told their behavior is not acceptable) I would say the exact sa…

Having empathy goes both ways. If one party has empathy and the other does not, it makes the relationship difficult.

If 'difficult' is the cut off point for a working relationship for a person, team or business, then that is ok. There are plenty of working environments where difficult relationships can work. But certainly not all of them.

Re: To hire neurodiverse workers, one firm got rid of job interviews

#283

Post by Nasrudith »

darkwater wrote: post #172
stared wrote: post #7

As an Aspie/ADD, I have never passed any formal interview, even for an intern position (sic!). (You can compare and contrast it with my GitHub/Resume/blog to make a judgment.) Fortunately, many times (even for mid-size companies or research institutes) the hiring was less formal. For small startups, where it is informal, I didn't feel at a disadvantage. For big, I don't believe I can pass through the first filter. It…

> Many symptoms of Aspie are taken for rudeness, ill intentions or trying to dominate (breaking a social rule => (s)he thinks (s)he is above it). Honest question: how do you find out if it's somebody with Asperger or just an asshole? I had a former colleague who maybe was in the spectrum or maybe it was just rude/uninterested all the time, and now I feel a bit guilty for him.

Well the two aren't mutually exclusive any more than other personal traits. A guy in a wheelchair can still be an asshole. The big sign for any sort of social ineptness is remorse if they find out they accidentally hurt someone. Although that definition may also be somewhat values influenced. Asian people are often stereotyped as rude for instance because of different standards. A grocer just silently bagging your goods and only speaking the bare minimum might be considered rude but for them it is the norm.

Re: To hire neurodiverse workers, one firm got rid of job interviews

#284

Post by RobertRoberts »

soulofmischief wrote: post #234
RobertRoberts wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Weird may be a simple emotional feeling people get because they sense you will mistreat them. (likely based on previous experience) What I have found dealing with people that are Aspie/ADD (father and brother) is they expect others to change behavior to adapt to themselves, but refuse to change their own behavior to adapt to others. (even when directly told their behavior is not acceptable) This means that many socia…

What I have found dealing with people that are Aspie/ADD (father and brother) How transparent you are in the fact that you are applying a completely anecdotal and personal experience to the largest possible generalization of ADD/Asperger's. That is very unscientific, and to people like me who deal with ADHD and a few other mental illnesses, downright offensive and prejudiced.

Aspie/ADD affected people often times accuse others, through technical language, how someone's feelings aren't important.

Yes, it is unscientific. It's my own personal experience that Aspie/ADD people often can't understand how much pain they can cause other people.

Re: To hire neurodiverse workers, one firm got rid of job interviews

#285

Post by CapricornNoble »

WillDaSilva wrote: post #80
shadowmore wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> ingrained misogyny was so common Was? I wouldn't call it misogyny, because it isn't out of hate but out of the unique social dynamics between genders, but absolutely nothing has changed except one thing: it's now politically incorrect and against the rules to actually say what you think/feel, so everyone hides it. Men and women still don't work well together. The attraction dynamics between them still overpower any…

> Men and women still don't work well together Citations needed. I've never had any issues working with women, nor have I heard any coworkers or friends express this belief, or raise issues about working with members of the opposite gender. I don't think people aren't talking about this because it's "politically incorrect", but rather because most people (at least in Canada) simply don't have any issues working with…

>>>Citations needed

Women in the infantry -- The Effect on the Moral Domain.[1] Covers a lot of ground, with pro/con data points across multiple nations and several decades.

[2] Is about the Navy's struggle with the costs and effectiveness impacts of pregnancies.

Can gender-integrated work forces produce (whatever the metric is for "productivity" in a particular domain). Yes. Will management/leadership responsibilities be inherently more complicated? Yes. Does gender diversity inherently guarantee an objectively superior output? No. I think that it is domain/problem-set specific. Human intelligence (HUMINT)[3] and civ-mil ops[4] absolutely benefit from female integration in order to fully access 50% of the population. Especially important in a counter-insurgency context.

[1]https://apps.dtic.mil/dtic/tr/fulltext/u2/a262478.pdf

[2]https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2017/apr/12/pregnant-na...

[3]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_intelligence_(intelligen...

[4]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civil-military_operations

Re: To hire neurodiverse workers, one firm got rid of job interviews

#286

Post by stallmanite »

nightcracker wrote: post #194
romwell wrote: post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly, and the way the parent didn't seem to fit into the 'culture' was by being older . "Frathouse culture" is an euphemism for "group of mostly white young male people who exclude people who aren't like them" - because this is what fraternities literally are . (Recall: by definition, fraternities are young, male, exclusive - and statistically, white).

It's not (only) statistically white, it is racism inherent in the language we use. A black fraternity is called a gang instead.

Do some research there are plenty of black fraternities at any major university in the US.

Re: To hire neurodiverse workers, one firm got rid of job interviews

#287

Post by auiya »

AnIdiotOnTheNet wrote: post #260
missosoup wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Never in my entire career have I been asked the 'where do you see yourself in 5 years' question. It doesn't even make sense in the tech world. In five years? There's a good chance your company/business unit won't exist and I'll be 1-2 jobs on from this one mate. Don't worry about it. It sounds like a hollywood movie cliche you'd hear at an interview scene. I'd laugh if I got that question in an actual interview. I'm…

> Never in my entire career have I been asked the 'where do you see yourself in 5 years' question. It doesn't even make sense in the tech world. In five years? There's a good chance your company/business unit won't exist and I'll be 1-2 jobs on from this one mate. Don't worry about it. And people wonder why everything in tech is garbage.

This paradigm isn't exclusive to tech. You have wage stagnation and asinine promotion/incentive policies to thank for it.

Re: To hire neurodiverse workers, one firm got rid of job interviews

#288

Post by romwell »

pluma wrote: post #231
x220 wrote: post #181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What if instead of discriminating by race, you don't hire people who live in mostly-black neighborhoods?

Codes of law aren't software. It's not a loophole, it's just an overly naive interpretation of what the law says based on your layperson understanding and applying programmer logic to non-software. If you explicitly don't accept applicants only from select neightborhoods that all just "happen to" be almost all-black, you're still discriminating by race and it's still obvious and obviously illegal. You'll just waste m…

The comment you are responding to is highlighting the ridiculousness of the comment above it.

However, everything you wrote does apply to the level-up comment.

Re: To hire neurodiverse workers, one firm got rid of job interviews

#289

Post by RobertRoberts »

watwut wrote: post #160
RobertRoberts wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Weird may be a simple emotional feeling people get because they sense you will mistreat them. (likely based on previous experience) What I have found dealing with people that are Aspie/ADD (father and brother) is they expect others to change behavior to adapt to themselves, but refuse to change their own behavior to adapt to others. (even when directly told their behavior is not acceptable) This means that many socia…

That is more about entitlent and what they generally value. I knew both neurotypical and aspie like that. And you are right that it amounts to abuse acceptance I knew also aspies (two) that did their best to listen and once we adjusted to his communication (e.g. learned to be extremely direct), it was not like that at all.

I agree that there are all kinds of people that act this way. But in my experience, aspies seem to have less ability to self reflect or alter behavior. Or more fundamentally admit they have anything to reflect on or alter. The very starting point of conflict resolution therefore is muted.

Re: To hire neurodiverse workers, one firm got rid of job interviews

#290

Post by RobertRoberts »

Smithalicious wrote: post #134
RobertRoberts wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Weird may be a simple emotional feeling people get because they sense you will mistreat them. (likely based on previous experience) What I have found dealing with people that are Aspie/ADD (father and brother) is they expect others to change behavior to adapt to themselves, but refuse to change their own behavior to adapt to others. (even when directly told their behavior is not acceptable) This means that many socia…

I know it's not intended, but this comment comes off as very mean. I don't know your father and brother, but that kind of assholish behavior is completely different orthogonal to having Aspergers or ADD.

This is the difficulty with Aspergers/ADD. They seem to not recognize that it's healthy and normal to call them on their bad behavior.
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