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Google chief: I'd disclose smart speakers before guests enter my home

bbc.com

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Re: Google chief: I'd disclose smart speakers before guests enter my home

#521

Post by Sendotsh »

madrox wrote: post #494

Every time an article like this comes up on HN it's the exact same concerns, the exact same HN comments, and the exact same arguments. I don't feel like the conversation has moved on significantly since Alexa came out. It makes me wonder why articles like these keep getting upvoted and commented on with the same stuff. Is this tabs vs spaces for the privacy world?

Tabs vs Spaces, Windows vs Apple (vs Linux to a smaller extent), Xbox vs PlayStation, Coke vs Pepsi, people are opinionated and it’s as old as time itself (religion, nationality, us vs them).

People like agreeing with those that agree with them, and disagreeing with those who don’t. Very rarely will any news on any of those topics actually progress anything, or change anyone’s beliefs/opinions, but people still like trying.

Re: Google chief: I'd disclose smart speakers before guests enter my home

#522

Post by mindcrime »

machello13 wrote: post #490
mindcrime wrote: post #343

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Always-on audio capture is a HORRIBLE idea in general. First, if it's stored - at all - then you have to ask "who else could get access to the recording besides (Google|Apple|whoever)?" Whether it's a nation-state via a search warrant, or some random script kiddie who hax0red the storage mechanism, once it's recorded you don't know WHO is going to get access, or what their intentions will be. Secondly, even if it's n…

Isn't this true with any device that has an embedded microphone? Laptops and pre-smart cell phones have had the same vulnerabilities for a very long time, no?

It's a fair point... unless a device has a hardware mute switch, it's hard to know for sure if somebody can activate it remotely for listening. But why add more attack vectors unnecessarily?

Re: Google chief: I'd disclose smart speakers before guests enter my home

#523

Post by maccard »

heavyset_go wrote: post #516
kelnos wrote: post #466

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I run OpenHAB at home (and have tried HA), but setting all this up is not in the wheelhouse of the majority of people. Doing the in-home setup is difficult enough, but safely exposing it to the internet is not something I'd ever ask a non-technical person to do. Meanwhile, you just swap your old thermostat with the Nest, tell it how to get to your wifi, install an app on your phone, and you're done.

I think you're overestimating how difficult it is to setup a smart device with something like Nabu Casa's Home Assistant Cloud.

And youre over estimating the technical literacy of the average person. This is the first time I've heard of nabu casa, I just checked out their website and they're immediately talking about yaml, I've browsed every page I can see and I can't see anything about setting it up. Another labe mentionrd docker and JWT as troubleshooting steps - that's too much for 99.99999% of people to ever use.

Re: Google chief: I'd disclose smart speakers before guests enter my home

#524

Post by bilbo0s »

hutzlibu wrote: post #499
nkrisc wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The government itself doing the things these corporation do would generate loads of outrage. For whatever reason it's a lot more acceptable for a company to collect all this data so you can play music with your voice and then the government can secretly collect it all later if they wish.

The point is, that a corporation takes data only from their customers who consent to it (if they would read it). The government would spie on potentielly everybody (and they do btw.)

Not really true.

FB for instance stores tagged image data of non-FB-users.

Re: Google chief: I'd disclose smart speakers before guests enter my home

#525

Post by ravenstine »

godelski wrote: post #468
TeMPOraL wrote: post #443

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They do, but they never abuse this capability.

I'd disagree with this. Frequently they look through peoples records. Whenever someone dies it is the first thing they do. They also on one hand talk about holo decks being a private space but how often do we see them walking in on peoples' sims. You could totally just shut down the sim from the outside if the person inside is not responding and that would more readily respect that person's privacy (but isn't good fo…

When someone dies or goes missing, not even an hour goes by before someone like Geordi or Riker is sifting through their personal log entries. :)

Re: Google chief: I'd disclose smart speakers before guests enter my home

#526

Post by jeremyjh »

mindcrime wrote: post #522
machello13 wrote: post #490

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't this true with any device that has an embedded microphone? Laptops and pre-smart cell phones have had the same vulnerabilities for a very long time, no?

It's a fair point... unless a device has a hardware mute switch, it's hard to know for sure if somebody can activate it remotely for listening. But why add more attack vectors unnecessarily?

Everyone in my house finds the Echo convenient. It is not a big deal, but neither is our threat model. There is no profit to anyone in spying on our kitchen. I'm much more wary of devices that radios, GPS and cameras, but I still use those too since they are even more convenient.

Re: Google chief: I'd disclose smart speakers before guests enter my home

#527

Post by friendlybus »

machello13 wrote: post #490
mindcrime wrote: post #343

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Always-on audio capture is a HORRIBLE idea in general. First, if it's stored - at all - then you have to ask "who else could get access to the recording besides (Google|Apple|whoever)?" Whether it's a nation-state via a search warrant, or some random script kiddie who hax0red the storage mechanism, once it's recorded you don't know WHO is going to get access, or what their intentions will be. Secondly, even if it's n…

Isn't this true with any device that has an embedded microphone? Laptops and pre-smart cell phones have had the same vulnerabilities for a very long time, no?

The general public didn't have a reason to distrust the devices. Snowden, Assange, email scandals and general overbearing decisions from tech companies black-holing things has shown the average joe there could be a problem.

Combine that with a general rise in authoritarianism and living outside of the US where these tech companies are based.. I can see the problems arising.

Re: Google chief: I'd disclose smart speakers before guests enter my home

#528

Post by icebraining »

jammygit wrote: post #501
Volundr wrote: post #469

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How else did you expect it to message him? Or let him turn it off remotely? Sure, could put a SIM in it and do an SMS that way, but then you have to pay for service for your thermostat, rather than just using the WIFI you already have.

Couldn’t it just have a lcd display with a scrolling alert message? Maybe even a red light that turns on to draw attention.

"I could turn off the unit remotely to prevent stress on the compressor"

Re: Google chief: I'd disclose smart speakers before guests enter my home

#530

Post by velosol »

astral303 wrote: post #113
prepend wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Google has implemented this asshole design/nagware in many products to push unnecessary to me and invasive data collection or functionality I want won’t be available. For example, their maps app on iOS won’t save locations for me unless I sign in an enable web history tracking. I get prompted every time I try to save a pin as well as every once in a while I’m case I change my mind. It’s a free app and it’s Google’s p…

I think Google Maps not saving your history as you described is an incredibly bad, frustrating experience. FFS, my phone has gigs of RAM, why can’t Google Maps remember the address I searched for ten minutes ago? One minute ago? This is 2019. It has been this bad for a decade plus. Embarrassing IMO and demonstrates true UX myopia and true UX incompetence.

Back in the Lollipop, maybe even KitKat days the maps app would save searches locally without web & app activity on similar to how the current gmail app keeps the last few searches locally even when you have web & app activity turned off in your profile.
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