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Google chief: I'd disclose smart speakers before guests enter my home

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Re: Google chief: I'd disclose smart speakers before guests enter my home

#441

Post by at-fates-hands »

saluki wrote: post #115

I was a huge Google Fan but this is becoming lunacy. I understood trading some data and privacy for great search results, maps and free quality email. But people willingly bringing always on listening devices in to their homes (beyond what smartphones are already capable of) I just can't comprehend it. Why would people voluntarily do this in exchange for being able to ask for weather, play a playlist, add a todo and…

> It just sounds like we are heading down the wrong road.

Humans are a lazy bunch and this feeds into these genetically coded tendencies in the worst way.

I feel like there is a growing backlash against these technologies that are getting way too invasive. Myself and a few of my friends have gone back to being as "analog" as possible. Dumb thermostats, dumb tv's, regular old key locks (you can still get some pretty secure, non-electronic locks), dumb fridges, etc, etc. The point is to disconnect as much as possible from the internet, Google, FB and Amazon. Three of my best friends now just carry Windows phones. Internet connected, very few apps, and phone service.

We are of course, a very small minority whose seen the dark side of these technologies. I don't think enough people know or understand the consequences of having these devices in their homes.

Re: Google chief: I'd disclose smart speakers before guests enter my home

#442

Post by Marsymars »

jwalton wrote: post #76
XJ6 wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All "big tech" are at it, I tried to go to "My Pictures" the other day and microsoft asked me to run my pictures through facial recognition. They said that by consenting I was asserting I had the consent of anyone who appeared in any of my photos or might appear in future which is insane to ask of anyone, no-one can really give that third party consent. Then when I refused they showed me a nag screen which didn't hav…

> I wanted to try the google podcasts but it was a brick because I had disabled "youtube & web activity" This is the worst. I have all the privacy settings turned up. In Google Maps on my phone, when I try to set my "Home" location, it tells me I need to turn on "Web and App Activity". What? Why? How are these two things related? Why do you have to track what apps I use and upload this info to Google in order to reme…

> Why do you have to track what apps I use and upload this info to Google in order to remember where my house is?

It's not a real requirement at all. I have "Home" and "Work" remembered from before it was a "requirement". They pop up as quick nav actions when holding the Google Maps homescreen icon on my phone, or when opening a GMaps Driving icon.

But I'm not allowed to set the "Home" and "Work" locations in the actual app, so they don't work via text or voice search.

Re: Google chief: I'd disclose smart speakers before guests enter my home

#443

Post by TeMPOraL »

sterlind wrote: post #424
TeMPOraL wrote: post #374

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It isn't. In fact, people there are uncomfortable about computers giving them orders (TNG S03E06). It works because in Star Trek, the society works. For instance, a ship's captain could easily access plenty of surveillance records about their whereabouts and activities, but as a matter of course, they don't . Cases where someone abuses technology for ulterior reasons are presented as negative, and protagonists do the…

In TNG they ask the computer for someone's location every other episode, usually without hesitation. Didn't go so well for Barclay, when they walked into his cringy holodeck fantasy program.

They do, but they never abuse this capability.

Re: Google chief: I'd disclose smart speakers before guests enter my home

#444

Post by Rebelgecko »

eslaught wrote: post #335
mey wrote: post #322

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I value privacy, my nest thermostat is the only IoT device in my house that talks to the internet or can be accessed remotely without a VPN. What I find most valuable is it programs itself. Am I cold? Turn it up a bit, hot? Turn it down a bit. Suddenly I have stopped having to adjust it at all. Even as life has changed. It has some nice other features, such as preheating/cooling, telling me how long it will take to g…

Ok, but what on this list actually requires an internet connection? I guess the integration with your power company. But aside from that? You could put a local AI model into the Nest, and it shouldn't need to talk to the internet at all. It can keep the data locally, and be programmed to draw inferences without help from the mothership. For some reason we've decided it's ok to gratuitously connect everything to the i…

>Ok, but what on this list actually requires an internet connection

I have a somewhat irregular work schedule, and on hot days was lifechanging to be able to turn the A/C on before I got home. Similarly, if you're on vacation and go "oh shit I forgot to turn the A/C off" it's nice to be able to do that remotely. The Nest has a motion detector but it's not 100% accurate. Maybe some non internet connected thermostats also detect presence, but it's nice to be able to confirm the state of the A/C remotely. I also like being able to graph the temperature/humidity of my place over time.

That said, my next thermostat will probably be an Ecobee because I'm pissed off about a number of decisions Nest has made lately (e.g. removing access to their API)

Re: Google chief: I'd disclose smart speakers before guests enter my home

#445

Post by nothrabannosir »

Clubber wrote: post #433
nkrisc wrote: post #309

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm very aware. That's kind of my point.

I'm sure selling data to the NSA, federal, state and local governments is very lucrative to these companies and is a primary revenue stream.

A primary revenue stream? For a public company, which has to publish its financials yet somehow keep this hidden? This sounds far fetched, to be honest.

Re: Google chief: I'd disclose smart speakers before guests enter my home

#446

Post by slouch »

bob1029 wrote: post #366
slouch wrote: post #301

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, but TVs aren't always on like this Nest device.

This is not always true anymore. Many modern Samsung TVs (and I am sure some other popular brands) have a standby update option, which would imply it is actually "always on". Ideally, it is only checking for the latest firmware version while you think it's off, but almost certainly it is doing other nefarious things you have zero visibility into.

> but almost certainly it is doing other nefarious things you have zero visibility into.

I just can't get on board with that.

https://www.consumerreports.org/privacy/how-to-turn-off-smar...

Re: Google chief: I'd disclose smart speakers before guests enter my home

#447

Post by Rebelgecko »

205guy wrote: post #398
exclusiv wrote: post #344

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A programmable keypad is nice. I have a Z-wave one which can notify my Smarthings hub which notifies me when it's locked or unlocked. The Nest thermostat allows me to control the heat remotely. These two things are great for rental properties. Guests often forget to lock the door, I have records of when guests or maintenance people are coming or going, I can adjust the heat to 55 when nobody is there which saves a lo…

It sounds like you have short-term rental properties, aka unregulated hotels, or more accurately regulation-skirting residential businesses. In normal rentals, guests are called tenants, and in most places tenants have all the same privacy rights as property owners. Therefore, a landlord having access to or retaining any information about door usage or audio-video of the property would likely be illegal. Perhaps a ca…

>That people make movies in places they expect privacy

If they're doing unpermitted guerilla filmmaking on someone else's property, they're just as guilty of violating someone's privacy and doing unregulated business activity.

FWIW, when I lived in a house where the landlord installed security cameras there wasn't much we could do about it. The law was on their side for outside cameras and cameras in common areas (like a laundry room)

Re: Google chief: I'd disclose smart speakers before guests enter my home

#448

Post by api »

TeMPOraL wrote: post #381
shadowgovt wrote: post #349

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lazy engineering gets to market first, and if most users don't find it harmful, the company wins?

Lazy, half-assed, corner-cutting everything gets to market first. This is a problem . It's also why markets accrue regulations over time.

We seem to have no good solution to this. Capitalism/cowboy development: ship crap fast, break stuff, accrue regulations. Socialism/planned economy: have meetings to plan meetings to discuss requirements forever and nothing ever happens.

While both were government funded, the "cowboy" approach of ArpaNet and IP vs the OSI network protocol consortia are a great case study.

Re: Google chief: I'd disclose smart speakers before guests enter my home

#449

Post by azarizotza »

saluki wrote: post #115

I was a huge Google Fan but this is becoming lunacy. I understood trading some data and privacy for great search results, maps and free quality email. But people willingly bringing always on listening devices in to their homes (beyond what smartphones are already capable of) I just can't comprehend it. Why would people voluntarily do this in exchange for being able to ask for weather, play a playlist, add a todo and…

This might be because I’m running on a half hour of sleep but I legit thought you said you were a Google Fan as if Google makes smart ceiling fans and you were somehow talking to me.

Re: Google chief: I'd disclose smart speakers before guests enter my home

#450

Post by [deleted] »

Rebelgecko wrote: post #447
205guy wrote: post #398

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It sounds like you have short-term rental properties, aka unregulated hotels, or more accurately regulation-skirting residential businesses. In normal rentals, guests are called tenants, and in most places tenants have all the same privacy rights as property owners. Therefore, a landlord having access to or retaining any information about door usage or audio-video of the property would likely be illegal. Perhaps a ca…

>That people make movies in places they expect privacy If they're doing unpermitted guerilla filmmaking on someone else's property, they're just as guilty of violating someone's privacy and doing unregulated business activity. FWIW, when I lived in a house where the landlord installed security cameras there wasn't much we could do about it. The law was on their side for outside cameras and cameras in common areas (li…

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