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Make More Land

jefftk.com

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Re: Make More Land

#201

Post by IanDrake »

dr_dshiv wrote: post #81

America has an attitude problem. It thinks it is already developed. Like, there is nothing left to do. That is the single biggest difference between the America of today and the America of the last century. The Netherlands feels more like India, in that everything is under a state of continual improvement all the time. The Netherlands is fantastically futuristic, though, and super nice (much more developed than most…

>America has an attitude problem

Yup.

>Like, there is nothing left to do.

Nope. That's not it.

More like: There is nothing you're allowed to do.

In my town, we tried to get a town only beach, since most of the beaches in town are owned and controlled by CCNS and fill up with tourists in the summer.

But our town owned undeveloped beach-front land, so we tried to get a parking lot approved. Sounds easy right?

Environmental impact study, traffic study, land use issues, etc... The final reason why we couldn't make this happen was a MOTH...an insect. That is why we don't do much any more. They want you to spend $50K on studies...just so they can tell you no.

Re: Make More Land

#202

Post by tathougies »

IanDrake wrote: post #201
dr_dshiv wrote: post #81

America has an attitude problem. It thinks it is already developed. Like, there is nothing left to do. That is the single biggest difference between the America of today and the America of the last century. The Netherlands feels more like India, in that everything is under a state of continual improvement all the time. The Netherlands is fantastically futuristic, though, and super nice (much more developed than most…

>America has an attitude problem Yup. >Like, there is nothing left to do. Nope. That's not it. More like: There is nothing you're allowed to do. In my town, we tried to get a town only beach, since most of the beaches in town are owned and controlled by CCNS and fill up with tourists in the summer. But our town owned undeveloped beach-front land, so we tried to get a parking lot approved. Sounds easy right? Environme…

Yeah, America thinks that, because it's already developed, it can go ahead and impose ridiculous limitations on development -- because we have to be 'enlightened' about growing more.

Re: Make More Land

#203

Post by rayiner »

IanDrake wrote: post #201
dr_dshiv wrote: post #81

America has an attitude problem. It thinks it is already developed. Like, there is nothing left to do. That is the single biggest difference between the America of today and the America of the last century. The Netherlands feels more like India, in that everything is under a state of continual improvement all the time. The Netherlands is fantastically futuristic, though, and super nice (much more developed than most…

>America has an attitude problem Yup. >Like, there is nothing left to do. Nope. That's not it. More like: There is nothing you're allowed to do. In my town, we tried to get a town only beach, since most of the beaches in town are owned and controlled by CCNS and fill up with tourists in the summer. But our town owned undeveloped beach-front land, so we tried to get a parking lot approved. Sounds easy right? Environme…

My daughter's school spent years in litigation to turn a failing golf course it had purchased into: 2/3 nature reserve and 1/3 athletic fields (for a small artsy school that hardly draws crowds to sporting events).

Re: Make More Land

#205

Post by jefftk »

xefer wrote: post #104
bwanab wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm looking out my window at Boston's seaport. It has been under heavy development for over 10 years that continues. It's like a new city within a city. You may find that attitude in some places, but here in America's oldest city, it doesn't appear to exist.

On the subjects of Boston, its new-ish Seaport District and "Make more land": was it ever under discussion to simply fill in the Fort Point Channel completely? That could have potentially knitted the Seaport development into the city itself. If I recall correctly, during the "Big Dig" work they had to jump through all sorts of hoops to run the new harbor tunnel road under the channel and deal with the water, and mud,…

> was it ever under discussion to simply fill in the Fort Point Channel completely?

At the end of the linked post I reference an earlier post of mine where I propose filling in the channel: https://www.jefftk.com/p/fill-in-fort-point-channel

Re: Make More Land

#206

Post by jefftk »

isostatic wrote: post #143
leetcrew wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I tend to lean libertarian on most issues, but I am starting to think it just doesn't make very much sense for people to own land privately. it's one of the only things in the world that is truly scarce (ie, you can't make more plots in the upper east side), and the value of land tends to be based much more on improvements to the surrounding area than improvements to the land itself. also, land ownership seems to lea…

A land value tax, where you pay for the value of the land. Society builds a new subway stations near you, and land increases 20%, you pay 20% more tax. Society puts a power plant on your doorstep, land drops 40%, and you pay 40% less tax. What you do with that land is irrelevent - you pay the same whether you have a small house on a 15 story building on it.

If you buy cheap land, build a subway out to it, and now the land is worth more, what should happen to your land value tax?

(I talked about this some in https://www.jefftk.com/p/land-value-taxes-are-distortionary , which I probably should have linked from the article)

Re: Make More Land

#207

Post by LeifCarrotson »

dr_dshiv wrote: post #81

America has an attitude problem. It thinks it is already developed. Like, there is nothing left to do. That is the single biggest difference between the America of today and the America of the last century. The Netherlands feels more like India, in that everything is under a state of continual improvement all the time. The Netherlands is fantastically futuristic, though, and super nice (much more developed than most…

No, that's a map of the parts of the Netherlands which were underwater.

Here: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Oceans_and_seas_boun... is a map of the parts of the Netherlands that are under water (highlighted in blue). They haven't colonized those parts yet. But as you say, they don't think they are done.

Or you may prefer the map at the bottom of the page on https://what-if.xkcd.com/53/ depending on how you think global warming will play out.

Re: Make More Land

#209

Post by jefftk »

driverdan wrote: post #60

> The world is very large, and cities are a very small portion of it. The land we set aside for animals should be outside of cities, where far more land is available at far less impact to people. Absurd. Just because a city happens to be there doesn't mean we should destroy the surrounding environment with impunity. Want to increase available housing in the bay? Get rid of NIMBY zoning that prevents building up.

(author here)

I'm also strongly in favor of abolishing the restrictive zoning that prohibits building up, but in many ways it's less politically practical to increase density in built-out areas than build new dense areas.

If we don't use small amounts of land close to cities to build new housing we'll continue with our default of using large amounts of land far from cities. This destroys more of the environment, pollutes with more driving, and wastes more time commuting.

Re: Make More Land

#210

Post by jefftk »

babyslothzoo wrote: post #208

Or you could incentivize building up? That'd be a lot easier and wouldn't create more hideous sprawl.

(author here)

Building up is already strongly incentivised: new units would sell for far above the costs of construction. But NIMYS use zoning and other restrictions to prevent it. I'm strongly in favor of fixing this, but building dense housing in places with no neighbors is another way to approach the problem.

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