Depressed People See the World More Realistically (2017) • Hacker News Board

Re: Depressed People See the World More Realistically (2017)

#271

Post by 4ntonius8lock » Wed, Oct 16, 2019, 8:35 PM UTC

enobrev wrote: post #267

monktastic1 wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To paraphrase Alan Watts, don't trust anyone who isn't in on the Great Cosmic Joke :)

This isn't a direct response to you, but moreso to this thread. There are some who are in on the joke and have even found quite a bit of humor in it, but no longer find that humor useful. It's like an old joke which was hilarious and insightful at one point but has been told too many times to remain interesting. I for one tend to envy those who either don't know or don't care. Being cynical seemed cool and somehow "s…

I've found that I need the humor more when I'm doing less/less well.

When I'm doing/doing well, I don't need the humor as the crushing weight of of existential dread and absurdity is drowned out by my involvement in life.

Re: Depressed People See the World More Realistically (2017)

#272

Post by wolfgke » Wed, Oct 16, 2019, 8:52 PM UTC

kharak wrote: post #266

cr0sh wrote: post #249

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'll take up the challenge: Fridge - well, the standard compressor powered refrigeration system is essentially a heat moving system. What we are doing is moving heat from the inside of the system (which is insulated and mostly "isolated" from the outside of the system) to the outside of the system. This is why you can't cool your house by opening your refrigerator's door, because the heat from the inside of the fridg…

Just finished the Youtube talk on degrading technology / knowledge. Really liked that perspective, although I disagree with quit a bit of Jonathan Blows points. About the challenge: I had the feeling, that you and a good chunk of readers here could go explain good deal of it all. But my point goes further: We all hit the wall of understanding sooner or later and all what is truly required is to know how use the techn…

> My brain obsesses with ideas that you would put more in the category of philosophy. It's what you think about when you have nothing to do or start daydreaming that's probably where your brain is best at. I never asked people in tech what they think about in those moments. I'm really, really curious about the answer.

My experience with these is: I often think that I have some deep mathematical insight. The problem with these insights is that they "partly right" - they are often based on a good mathematical intuition of mine. But unluckily the mathematical research typically has come a lot farther than my insight - i.e. my insight is actually a really old hat in mathematical research.

So instead of daydreaming about some clever mathematical insight of yours, better cram advanced math textbooks - they will teach you a lot more than what you will ever come up with by daydreaming.

Re: Depressed People See the World More Realistically (2017)

#273

Post by monktastic1 » Wed, Oct 16, 2019, 8:54 PM UTC

enobrev wrote: post #267

monktastic1 wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To paraphrase Alan Watts, don't trust anyone who isn't in on the Great Cosmic Joke :)

This isn't a direct response to you, but moreso to this thread. There are some who are in on the joke and have even found quite a bit of humor in it, but no longer find that humor useful. It's like an old joke which was hilarious and insightful at one point but has been told too many times to remain interesting. I for one tend to envy those who either don't know or don't care. Being cynical seemed cool and somehow "s…

I don't know that it makes me cynical. For me it's more akin to a reminder to not sweat the small stuff too much (and it's pretty much all small stuff).

Re: Depressed People See the World More Realistically (2017)

#274

Post by aianus » Wed, Oct 16, 2019, 9:18 PM UTC

harimau777 wrote: post #143

How do you guys think this relates to Cognitive Therapy? What I mean is: My father was a therapist and a big advocate of the idea that people can be happy regardless of their circumstances and that emotion comes primarily from what someone thinks. There's a lot of truth in that, and it seems clear that Cognitive Therapy is an important treatment for depression. However, he sometimes seemed to de-emphasize the importa…

I read that moving to somewhere sunny like Southern California was several times more effective for depression than SSRIs.

Re: Depressed People See the World More Realistically (2017)

#275

Post by jrs235 » Wed, Oct 16, 2019, 9:43 PM UTC

p10_user wrote: post #240

blotter_paper wrote: post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the first one being no one without their highschool diploma or G.E.D. (General Education Diploma) should read it. Could you unpack this for me?

I suppose parent poster means that people who haven’t finished high school may take it too much at face value, and not take education seriously.

Correct. My concern is if young folks, such as when I was in middle or high school, read this they might become too underachieving.

Re: Depressed People See the World More Realistically (2017)

#276

Post by VvR-Ox » Wed, Oct 16, 2019, 9:44 PM UTC

gfodor wrote: post #159

VvR-Ox wrote: post #35

Why am I not surprised? The world is really going down right now and just following news what's going on is reason enough to cry like a baby or lose it completely. That's one of the main reasons why many people take drugs - it helps to forget what's happening around us and it makes us numb enough to stop feeling the constant pain when we think about the things happening to our brothers and sisters who aren't lucky en…

I hate to break it to you, but if the news is affecting your mental health you should realize that that is by design. The world may or may not be in a good state of affairs in an absolute sense, but it is better than it has ever been, and insofar as the news seems worse now than in the past, that has more to do with those in charge of the news media and their incentives and biases than actual changes in the state of…

You are absolutely right about the design of the news but despite this very bad things are happening (just the facts).

Let me bring in some of those facts:

1. "25.9 million refugees globally -- the highest level ever recorded" according to Amnesty International (https://www.amnesty.org/en/what-we-do/refugees-asylum-seeker...)

2. "Global emissions increased from 2 billion tonnes of carbon dioxide in 1900 to over 36 billion tonnes 115 years later" (https://ourworldindata.org/co2-and-other-greenhouse-gas-emis...)

3. "Plastic in the oceans" (https://ourworldindata.org/where-does-plastic-accumulate)

4. "52.4 percent decline in sperm concentration and a 59.3 percent decline in total sperm counts from 1973 to 2011 for men in the West" (https://www.researchgate.net/blog/post/sperm-counts-in-the-w...)

Ok I will stop it right here but of course there are many more tendencies that would speak against a too optimistic view on the world at the moment in my opinion.

Of course there is enough media, drugs and be-happy-every-day-mantras etc. to disturb your thoughts and allow to ignore all this.

Re: Depressed People See the World More Realistically (2017)

#277

Post by jrs235 » Wed, Oct 16, 2019, 9:44 PM UTC

dredmorbius wrote: post #263

jrs235 wrote: post #214

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interesting and WTF for sure. Must have rubbed some people the wrong way... Reading it can be frightening for overachievers and people whose world view and beliefs (the upper class who need servants) requires we have people working for them otherwise their materialist and GDP/economy driven world views might cease to exist...

It's more that the percentages, whilst adding up, don't match.

What if it's an easter egg / joke facilitated by Amazon employees... making their calculator [perhaps only for this book] perform incorrectly... hence underachieving?

Re: Depressed People See the World More Realistically (2017)

#278

Post by VvR-Ox » Wed, Oct 16, 2019, 9:56 PM UTC

tim333 wrote: post #202

VvR-Ox wrote: post #35

Why am I not surprised? The world is really going down right now and just following news what's going on is reason enough to cry like a baby or lose it completely. That's one of the main reasons why many people take drugs - it helps to forget what's happening around us and it makes us numb enough to stop feeling the constant pain when we think about the things happening to our brothers and sisters who aren't lucky en…

The world is getting better in many ways. Check out Pinker et al. eg. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yCm9Ng0bbEQ&t=770s

I don't see how he arrives at the conclusion there would be less pollution. Compared to when? What exactly would he define as such?

I could counter all the stuff he proposes now with bringing in more of the bad news but I've already done that in another answer if you are interested.

He can be optimistic as he is a white male with prosperity. This group is the one with the best conditions on earth - it's easy to enjoy life if you can be a part of that.

The people who suffer the most don't even have the luxury to think about global concerns and inequality. They have to fight to survive every day and they have to feed their families and escape the next war to finally arrive in the West where he will be treated worse than a dog.

Please ask these people how they cannot share his positive view on our planet.

Re: Depressed People See the World More Realistically (2017)

#279

Post by VvR-Ox » Wed, Oct 16, 2019, 9:57 PM UTC

smt88 wrote: post #65

VvR-Ox wrote: post #35

Why am I not surprised? The world is really going down right now and just following news what's going on is reason enough to cry like a baby or lose it completely. That's one of the main reasons why many people take drugs - it helps to forget what's happening around us and it makes us numb enough to stop feeling the constant pain when we think about the things happening to our brothers and sisters who aren't lucky en…

In many ways (disease, poverty, social well-being) the world is better than it ever has been. Just because bad things are happening and dominate news doesn't mean that's all that's happening or that the net is negative.

Sorry please see the other answers as you share some of your thoughts on my words and I've already given my answers to that.

Re: Depressed People See the World More Realistically (2017)

#280

Post by blotter_paper » Wed, Oct 16, 2019, 10:15 PM UTC

jrs235 wrote: post #275

p10_user wrote: post #240

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I suppose parent poster means that people who haven’t finished high school may take it too much at face value, and not take education seriously.

Correct. My concern is if young folks, such as when I was in middle or high school, read this they might become too underachieving.

Okay, the age at which somebody is exposed to certain media seems like a potentially valid concern. I thought you were making a statement about adults who hadn't obtained those credentials, which would be a whole other bag of worms; it's possible to attend college without a highschool diploma or equivalent, and it's also possible to achieve difficult things without either of those pieces of paper in hand.