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Blizzard Cancels Overwatch Event

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Re: Blizzard Cancels Overwatch Event

#411

Post by leereeves »

moksly wrote: post #392
echelon wrote: post #202

We need to impose an 80% repatriation tax on any profits earned in China in order to offset the damages done to our domestic freedom of speech. China should not be able to control society outside of its own walls, yet they have blatantly influenced the behavior of our biggest mass media companies for years. To be fair, they've done an outstanding job of it. They fund a huge number of film productions. They've bought…

> They've bought out our cinema chains and gaming companies. All the while we never once see China portrayed as an enemy. I agree with most of what you say, but as a Dane who grew up watching Hollywood movies portraying America, it’s also a little funny for this particular part, to be happening to America. Don’t get me wrong, I’d rather be manipulated into liking a free society than a dictatorship, but I’m sure you f…

> Hollywood movies portraying America

That's not really comparable because those are American movies. Is America preventing Europeans from making movies that portray America negatively?

If China makes its own movies where they are the heroes, that's fine, but they shouldn't be able to prevent anyone outside China from making movies where they are portrayed negatively.

Re: Blizzard Cancels Overwatch Event

#412

Post by leereeves »

skocznymroczny wrote: post #390
echelon wrote: post #202

We need to impose an 80% repatriation tax on any profits earned in China in order to offset the damages done to our domestic freedom of speech. China should not be able to control society outside of its own walls, yet they have blatantly influenced the behavior of our biggest mass media companies for years. To be fair, they've done an outstanding job of it. They fund a huge number of film productions. They've bought…

I don't think of it as free speech issue. If an Overwatch streamer was banned for wearing a MAGA hat, most of the community would cheer Blizzard for that.

That's true, much of the community doesn't really support free speech, unfortunately, but some of us do and for us this is a free speech issue.

The Chinese government has zero respect for free speech and as they gain more power outside China we're watching our own freedom of speech disappear.

So in this instance, people who support free speech and people who just oppose China are aligned.

Re: Blizzard Cancels Overwatch Event

#413

Post by valley-green »

echelon wrote: post #202

We need to impose an 80% repatriation tax on any profits earned in China in order to offset the damages done to our domestic freedom of speech. China should not be able to control society outside of its own walls, yet they have blatantly influenced the behavior of our biggest mass media companies for years. To be fair, they've done an outstanding job of it. They fund a huge number of film productions. They've bought…

80% tax because we can’t talk shit about Hong Kong? You have no sense.

Re: Blizzard Cancels Overwatch Event

#414

Post by jug »

cjbprime wrote: post #10

The huge question here is what's going to happen at BlizzCon in two weeks. There'll be 40,000+ attendees, cameras everywhere, there are usually Q&A panels, homemade signs for player support, cosplay, everything. How can you host BlizzCon when you're terrified of political speech?

It's also, importantly, broadcast live to those who have bought access. Anything happening live will leak instantly if it's drama, like it did last year during the Diablo Immortal debacle. sigh...

I'm sure Blizzard will spend some extra time and resources on the entrance visitations this year so that no one brings anything dangerous with them (or rotten tomatoes), but they will never be able to stop speech or 20 people getting in just to chant Hong Kong. That will be heard until they're carried away and it will dampen the mood over the entire Blizzcon. They have no way to win other than to forcefully remove them, which looks bad too.

So there's no way to win for Blizzard on this one IF anything happens, but they brought it onto themselves and I have a hard time feeling sympathy towards anyone who have such a heavy handed approach to protests for democratic rights and an upheld juridical system. Yes, politics don't belong in a gaming stream but a reprimand towards everyone involved and a cut stream ought to have been enough here.

Re: Blizzard Cancels Overwatch Event

#415

Post by jug »

daemin wrote: post #403
cjbprime wrote: post #10

The huge question here is what's going to happen at BlizzCon in two weeks. There'll be 40,000+ attendees, cameras everywhere, there are usually Q&A panels, homemade signs for player support, cosplay, everything. How can you host BlizzCon when you're terrified of political speech?

They will search all persons and bags on entry and confiscate any material that is deemed "political". They will do this on the grounds of safety and security so "people won't throw dangerous objects at competitors" and "nudity and hate speech will not be on signs" as it's an all ages event.

It's still not enough if attendees start chanting. Heck some may go only to do that.

Re: Blizzard Cancels Overwatch Event

#416

Post by Pfhreak »

nyolfen wrote: post #407
Pfhreak wrote: post #326

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because it's fairly common to signal boost someone who you may or may not agree with, and having the information can be useful for someone who previously was unaware?

sorry, how are rumors about what he was fired for useful information?

Because there was an appeal to his authority on the matter as a blizzard dev in the op.

Re: Blizzard Cancels Overwatch Event

#417

Post by cthalupa »

skocznymroczny wrote: post #390
echelon wrote: post #202

We need to impose an 80% repatriation tax on any profits earned in China in order to offset the damages done to our domestic freedom of speech. China should not be able to control society outside of its own walls, yet they have blatantly influenced the behavior of our biggest mass media companies for years. To be fair, they've done an outstanding job of it. They fund a huge number of film productions. They've bought…

I don't think of it as free speech issue. If an Overwatch streamer was banned for wearing a MAGA hat, most of the community would cheer Blizzard for that.

This sort of argument is so shitty. "If this thing that hasn't happened, happened, then people would do X action"

How do you argue against it? It's a hypothetical event that hasn't occurred. You get to feel smug with your point and no one can actually disprove it.

I generally find people that are so aggressive with their passive announcement of political values aren't the type of people I want to associate with, but I'm not going to say someone wearing a MAGA hat should be banned from playing Overwatch. It wouldn't even occur to me as something to suggest.

Re: Blizzard Cancels Overwatch Event

#418

Post by cthalupa »

rjf72 wrote: post #398
2bitencryption wrote: post #317

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the problem is like this: Blizzard creates art/items/events specifically catering to LGBTQ, with the concept that in modern western countries this is not a controversial stance but the only decent stance. Then, at an event, a tournament winner is given a chance to speak and calls for democracy and freedom in Hong Kong. Blizzard's response to this is ban him, take his prize away, ban the tournament casters for…

When forming opinions on things like this, I think its important to see what happened in context. This [1] is the entire, in context, video of the controversy in question. Unfortunately I've yet to find a complete translated transcript so I am left on relying on potentially unreliable online translations. From what I've read the casters say 'Go ahead and say those 8 words and we'll wrap up here. There's nothing else…

Nothing in that video should change anyone's mind on the issue on anything except whether or not the casters were also involved. I don't see how any of it changes anything important about the issue - Blizzard is censoring political speech for their own financial gain.

Why would it matter if three people were involved in the political speech rather than just one?

There's no guarantee in life that everything is shades of gray. Sometimes people really are evil. They're not Hollywood villains - Hollywood can't sell the level of evil some people actually are. Go read about the Falun Gong and organ harvesting.

Re: Blizzard Cancels Overwatch Event

#419

Post by cthalupa »

modriano wrote: post #362
manicdee wrote: post #316

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s only a “no win” if you consider losing business with an autocratic nation responsible for mass violation of human rights to be “losing”.

In the US, public companies "have an obligation to their shareholders to be profitable", and China is a gigantic market. The rules that govern the economy aren't optimized to create equity or equality. They're optimized to push companies to maximize profit and minimize scarcity. Without proper regulation, the companies that optimize for profit will scale much faster than the companies that optimize for ethics or equa…

>In the US, public companies "have an obligation to their shareholders to be profitable", and China is a gigantic market.

This simply isn't true and I wish people would stop repeating it.

https://www.lawschool.cornell.edu/academics/clarke_business_...

> "modern corporate law does not require for-profit corporations to pursue profit at the expense of everything else, and many do not do so."

Re: Blizzard Cancels Overwatch Event

#420

Post by cthalupa »

darklajid wrote: post #328
ryacko wrote: post #321

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But in the West it is expected that token political statements are to be allowed and protected. "Free HK" isn't a particularly complex political statement, and it is over a topic which Westerners think is unfairly suppressed. A similar comparison would be if Saudi Arabia had Blizzard ban someone for saying "Don't execute rape victims."

> But in the West it is expected that token political statements are to be allowed and protected. Is that so? I could imagine a huuuge amount of political statements that are illegal in my home country, Germany. Since I was raised there these rules are ingrained in me: "Free Speech" is not a thing (if we compare it to the US) and - that's the important part - I don't DISAGREE with that. > "Free HK" isn't a particular…

>Is it not? I truly, honestly, don't know how complex that is in the end, compared to - say - supporting Texas leving the US, Bavaria leaving Germany, Basque leaving Spain

The HK protestors aren't attempting to secede in any real quantity. It is not on their list of demands. They want a free Hong Kong, but it being part of China is perfectly acceptable as long as they have that freedom.

>Westerner here. No, I don't want ANY political agenda in game streams.

Perhaps you should, so you can be more informed on a position before posting opinions such as this. As evidenced by the above, you don't actually know what this protest is about, yet are trying to create comparisons that will mislead others that are uninformed.

>No. I was going to write out a lengthier response about what the similarities actually are between the two, but you provided a zero effort response, so I guess I can too:

Yes.

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