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Blizzard Cancels Overwatch Event

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Re: Blizzard Cancels Overwatch Event

#331

Post by triceratops »

flukus wrote: post #315
Latty wrote: post #299

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Free speech is about not being arrested for expression. You are talking about companies being compelled to repeat speech, and that begs a lot of questions: what speech, by whom, how much relative time and visibility are different bits of speech given?

Free speech is an ideal, the constitutional protection is only an implementation and in the modern world arguably not the most important one. As for compelling companies to do business with people they don't want to, we crossed that line long ago, they can't refuse service to people on the ground of race, sex, etc. Are you in favor of getting rid of anti-discrimination laws?

Protected characteristics i.e. things you can't use as a basis for discrimination are things that people can't change about themselves. Refusing to do business because you don't like what someone is saying is different from refusing to do business on the basis of a protected characteristic.

Re: Blizzard Cancels Overwatch Event

#332

Post by SmirkingRevenge »

mintplant wrote: post #289
falcolas wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Perhaps not cleanly stated, but true. Blizzard quite explicitly catered to the LGBTQ+ demographic recently via an Overwatch promotion, a move that can easily be construed as political speech (and which was voluntarily censored by Blizzard in Russia and China). They stuck their feet into this arena, and are now realizing that making political statement can affect their revenue in both directions.

So, what, as an LGBTQ+ person, I'm not allowed to be represented in media? Because my existence is "political"?

Ehh... I think in common usage the "LGBTQ+" designation is fairly politically loaded. It really is intertwined with specific strains of political activism (mostly progressive left). And because of that, all sorts of policy views and prescriptions on ancillary matters have coalesced under the "LGBTQ+" umbrella. It may even say more about one's political identity/grouping at this point, than it does about sexual preferences or gender identity, etc.

Re: Blizzard Cancels Overwatch Event

#333

Post by alex_c »

darklajid wrote: post #310
falcolas wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Perhaps not cleanly stated, but true. Blizzard quite explicitly catered to the LGBTQ+ demographic recently via an Overwatch promotion, a move that can easily be construed as political speech (and which was voluntarily censored by Blizzard in Russia and China). They stuck their feet into this arena, and are now realizing that making political statement can affect their revenue in both directions.

I don't understand the line of reasoning here. If Blizzard wants to (appear to, if we doubt their sincerity) support a political cause, that's a decision by the company. I agree that they should expect a potential fallout for that. But how is that related to Blizzard sponsoring (paying for casters, production and using their branding) content where random individuals make their own political statements (imho: present…

Context is important.

Context #1: there has been a years-long trend for Western entertainment media (movies, games) to cater to the Chinese market. This ranges from voluntary censorship that seems odd in the West (no skeletons?) to more sensitive topics like sexuality.

Specifically, last year Blizzard disappointed fans by announcing a mobile Diablo game that no one really asked for and that many felt is squarely aimed at the Chinese market.

Context #2: the trade war and Hong Kong protests have brought a lot of attention to China in general. The Hong Kong protests seem to be particularly popular with younger people online.

Context #3: Blizzard's reaction seemed particularly swift and heavy-handed, giving the impression that it was more about not offending China than about discouraging political statements on streams. Blizzard's announcement on Chinese social media supported this impression, and their delayed and lukewarm non-apology statement in the US didn't do much to change that perception.

Further, Blizzard's support for LGBTQ suggests that it's not just about political statements on the stream, but the content of the statements is important. Put another way: would Blizzard's response be the same if the unauthorized statement was pro-LGBTQ rather than pro-HK? There is no way to know for sure, but if the answer is "no" that means Blizzard is indirectly picking sides.

Combine all that and Blizzard put themselves in an impossible situation with no good way forward.

My personal opinion: it probably was about China, it probably was a decision made locally further down the corporate ladder, and US HQ is now stuck with something they can't fix.

Re: Blizzard Cancels Overwatch Event

#334

Post by lostmsu »

tutiospose wrote: post #329
not_a_cop75 wrote: post #223

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You could all wear "Winnie the Pooh China" shirts. If you get kicked out for those, that will really be the shit hitting the fan for them. That's not even protest. That's simple freedom of expression.

It’s not actually banned. There’s a Winnie the Pooh ride in Shanghai Disneyland. You can also watch Winnie the Pooh cartoons on Chinese streaming services.

Can you share a link to the cartoon?

Re: Blizzard Cancels Overwatch Event

#335

Post by JKCalhoun »

datapunk wrote: post #55
cjbprime wrote: post #10

The huge question here is what's going to happen at BlizzCon in two weeks. There'll be 40,000+ attendees, cameras everywhere, there are usually Q&A panels, homemade signs for player support, cosplay, everything. How can you host BlizzCon when you're terrified of political speech?

How do you respond when a character from your top grossing game is turned into a political meme? This is what Blizzard has been learning this week. How do you handle potentially thousands of attendees, at your organization's biggest annual event, turning it into a platform for political protest agaisnt your biggest growing market? There's three possible events: BlizzCon is canceled. Extremely unlikely but possible. B…

It seems obvious to me: C, Blizzard does nothing.

Re: Blizzard Cancels Overwatch Event

#336

Post by lostmsu »

alasdair_ wrote: post #56
cjbprime wrote: post #10

The huge question here is what's going to happen at BlizzCon in two weeks. There'll be 40,000+ attendees, cameras everywhere, there are usually Q&A panels, homemade signs for player support, cosplay, everything. How can you host BlizzCon when you're terrified of political speech?

I, and several friends, all have tickets. We're still deciding what form of protest will be most effective (too overt and the message gets quickly lost when security kicks you out).

The easiest, safest and very noticeable one is to wear a T-shirt with relevant message.

Re: Blizzard Cancels Overwatch Event

#337

Post by throwaway2048 »

wbl wrote: post #252
DoreenMichele wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I haven't followed the situation closely, but we never get to A/B test such decisions. We make a decision and see the outcome for which one we chose. Saying they created this situation is a little like blaming a casualty of war for living in the country they were born in. China exists and it's a large country with growing power that has fundamental cultural differences with the West and always has. There may be bette…

This isn't a fundamental cultural difference. This is a tyranny that brokes no dissent and murders its people to stay in power.

People that try to pin this as a cultural difference only need to look at Taiwan, which is a functioning democracy, and equally as Chinese.

Re: Blizzard Cancels Overwatch Event

#338

Post by throwaway8879 »

darklajid wrote: post #328
ryacko wrote: post #321

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But in the West it is expected that token political statements are to be allowed and protected. "Free HK" isn't a particularly complex political statement, and it is over a topic which Westerners think is unfairly suppressed. A similar comparison would be if Saudi Arabia had Blizzard ban someone for saying "Don't execute rape victims."

> But in the West it is expected that token political statements are to be allowed and protected. Is that so? I could imagine a huuuge amount of political statements that are illegal in my home country, Germany. Since I was raised there these rules are ingrained in me: "Free Speech" is not a thing (if we compare it to the US) and - that's the important part - I don't DISAGREE with that. > "Free HK" isn't a particular…

I agree with you. I don't play video games, but at this point in my life, I don't even want normal politics, why would I want politics in my entertainment?

Probably also why I'm seriously turned off by musicians with political agenda, like Roger Waters.

Re: Blizzard Cancels Overwatch Event

#339

Post by belltaco »

falcolas wrote: post #285
belltaco wrote: post #243

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Funny that no one is talking about voting with their wallet by not buying Chinese products.

Some people are. But since this article is explicitly about Blizzard, people are focusing on their actions with Blizzard.

Can you point to some recentish posts where is there is such discussion?

Re: Blizzard Cancels Overwatch Event

#340

Post by Splines »

JKCalhoun wrote: post #335
datapunk wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do you respond when a character from your top grossing game is turned into a political meme? This is what Blizzard has been learning this week. How do you handle potentially thousands of attendees, at your organization's biggest annual event, turning it into a platform for political protest agaisnt your biggest growing market? There's three possible events: BlizzCon is canceled. Extremely unlikely but possible. B…

It seems obvious to me: C, Blizzard does nothing.

Is Blizzcon streamed in China? I agree - nothing will happen. They'll likely heavily filter what they broadcast in China if they do stream there, and that's about all they can possibly do.
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