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Building China's Comac C919 airplane involved a lot of hacking, report says

zdnet.com

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Re: Building China's Comac C919 airplane involved a lot of hacking, report says

#101

Post by ddiq »

thinkcontext wrote: post #69
president wrote: post #33

> In the rare occasions when the hacking team couldn't find a way inside a target, a second MSS JSSD officer would intervene and recruit a Chinese national working for the target company, and use him to plant Sakula on the victim's network, usually via USB drives. I'm not sure how the US is going to deal with things like this given that we have so many Chinese nationals working in most major corporations across so ma…

There's a crackdown underway. "Is it police work or racial profiling? U.S. crackdown puts Chinese scholars on edge" https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2019-07-21/trump-ch...

Racial profiling is just a slur for pattern recognition. If it turns out that 95% of Chinese scholars in the US are more loyal to China than to America, and that when given a chance, will illegally send information back to China, what are you supposed to do?

It's fine if you don't want to have a racial bias yourself, but it doesn't mean you need to ignore the fact that (in this hypothetical) the vast majority of Chinese are highly ethnocentric.

Re: Building China's Comac C919 airplane involved a lot of hacking, report says

#102

Post by bcatanzaro »

freyr wrote: post #100
aclsid wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a non-US nor Chinese national, I find it interesting how the US keeps creating these artificial enemies. Of course the Chinese are not pro-America but they are very much self-contained and just interested in making money. Aside from internal old and new revolutions, China have also had a long history of not invading other countries. I can understand that the US feels threatened by the massive competition created o…

//

Yup. Lots of sleight-of-hand in this claim.

China does have a long history of invading other countries, but they try to suppress knowledge of it. That’s why they’re so hypersensitive about the definition of China, because they’re hiding their present and former invasions.

Tibet, Xinjiang, Taiwan, all the islands inside the vague nine-dashed line... Even border disputes with India.

Re: Building China's Comac C919 airplane involved a lot of hacking, report says

#103

Post by djsumdog »

ddiq wrote: post #101
thinkcontext wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a crackdown underway. "Is it police work or racial profiling? U.S. crackdown puts Chinese scholars on edge" https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2019-07-21/trump-ch...

Racial profiling is just a slur for pattern recognition. If it turns out that 95% of Chinese scholars in the US are more loyal to China than to America, and that when given a chance, will illegally send information back to China, what are you supposed to do? It's fine if you don't want to have a racial bias yourself, but it doesn't mean you need to ignore the fact that (in this hypothetical) the vast majority of Chin…

During WW2, there was an internment camp called Manzanar, where the US put all the Japanese, even those with full American citizenship, simply because they were Japanese.

Re: Building China's Comac C919 airplane involved a lot of hacking, report says

#104

Post by goatinaboat »

aclsid wrote: post #90
ekianjo wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I imagine the ones that are outspoken against the CCP have a much harder time going abroad in the first place. Resistance against the CCP is a very tiny minority since there is a heavy brainwashing about how great everything CCP does since kids go to school at a young age - and they never get any other version of reality.

Kind of similar to North America in a way. And just like the Chinese, you guys don't realize it because as the saying goes, everybody thinks their crap doesn't stink. Sure in the case of China it is a more crude form of propaganda, but if you don't believe me, just try to find information about what happened in Ecuador just now in your newsmedia. That information was supressed by media conglomerates because of a pro-…

Kind of similar to North America in a way.

Not really the same. Americans are taught to love an abstract, idealised version of America, an eagle perched atop a flag, and it doesn’t really work, half of Americans hate even that, and that’s fine, no one really cares. Whereas the Chinese are taught to love a specific leader of a specific party operating a specific system, etc. And the consequences for not complying are harsh.

Re: Building China's Comac C919 airplane involved a lot of hacking, report says

#105

Post by DiogenesKynikos »

freyr wrote: post #100
aclsid wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a non-US nor Chinese national, I find it interesting how the US keeps creating these artificial enemies. Of course the Chinese are not pro-America but they are very much self-contained and just interested in making money. Aside from internal old and new revolutions, China have also had a long history of not invading other countries. I can understand that the US feels threatened by the massive competition created o…

//

> Read up on what's happening today in Africa and Afghanistan. Or the many examples of state-sponsored corporate espionage and hacking. Are these not forms of invasion in 2019?

I do recall a couple of countries invading Afghanistan, none of them named "China."

If you're going to call building railroads, highways, power plants and other infrastructure in Africa an "invasion," that's just plain unreasonable. I get that you may find the amount of debt African nations are taking on troubling, but it's dangerous hyperbole to call this sort of thing an "invasion."

Re: Building China's Comac C919 airplane involved a lot of hacking, report says

#106

Post by cocoggu »

ekianjo wrote: post #83
TkTech wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree with you (Someone from France doesn't have to worry about the modern version of China's 9 generation purge[1]), but as a Canadian it's very common to see the Chinese students here wildly supportive of the CCP, including harassing and attacking Hong Kong protesters. I imagine the ones that are outspoken against the CCP have a much harder time going abroad in the first place. With a billion and a half citizens…

> I imagine the ones that are outspoken against the CCP have a much harder time going abroad in the first place. Resistance against the CCP is a very tiny minority since there is a heavy brainwashing about how great everything CCP does since kids go to school at a young age - and they never get any other version of reality.

Disclaimer: I'm french and I'm living in China since my wife is Chinese.

It's not only about brainwashing.

40 years ago 85% of the chinese population was below the poverty line. Today it's between 10% and 15%. Under the party governance, almost everyone saw their life standards go up substantially. A lot of the people studying abroad saw their family starting from the bottom and they can now afford to study in western universities. They think the Chinese system works because economically it is working very well so far.

Just another example: We have some friends who bought a very expensive new apartment in Beijing (around 4.5M US$). This is a brand new residence founded by Wang Jianlin, the founder of Wanda Group (the most powerful estate developer in China). The government allowed him to run this project under one condition: to build 3 apartment blocks on the same field (sharing the same park) which will be given to families under the poverty line. A lot of the wealthy people complained a lot about this, 1/3 of them got a refund and the price of the apartments dropped.

So to get back to my point, this is not only brainwashing. The party is giving its people a new life, and these people will be thankful and loyal for at least decades.

I'm curious about how a long term economic recession could change people minds though.

Re: Building China's Comac C919 airplane involved a lot of hacking, report says

#107

Post by goatinaboat »

microcolonel wrote: post #75
thinkcontext wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a crackdown underway. "Is it police work or racial profiling? U.S. crackdown puts Chinese scholars on edge" https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2019-07-21/trump-ch...

Well, when your adversary is effectively an ethnostate (at least in terms of the classes capable of travel), scrutiny on their nationals is going to be harder to distinguish from racial profiling (if most Chinese people where you're at are new). At least, we should be monitoring Confucius Institute outposts and scams/blackmail making Chinese nationals vulnerable in the U.S. and Canada.

Well, when your adversary is effectively an ethnostate

I would be willing to bet there is precisely zero wailing about “Han supremacy” on Chinese campuses too.

I’ll further bet there are precisely zero “Pooh is not my president-for-life” protests either.

Re: Building China's Comac C919 airplane involved a lot of hacking, report says

#108

Post by [deleted] »

DiogenesKynikos wrote: post #105
freyr wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

//

> Read up on what's happening today in Africa and Afghanistan. Or the many examples of state-sponsored corporate espionage and hacking. Are these not forms of invasion in 2019? I do recall a couple of countries invading Afghanistan, none of them named "China." If you're going to call building railroads, highways, power plants and other infrastructure in Africa an "invasion," that's just plain unreasonable. I get that…

[deleted]

Re: Building China's Comac C919 airplane involved a lot of hacking, report says

#109

Post by Judgmentality »

djsumdog wrote: post #103
ddiq wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Racial profiling is just a slur for pattern recognition. If it turns out that 95% of Chinese scholars in the US are more loyal to China than to America, and that when given a chance, will illegally send information back to China, what are you supposed to do? It's fine if you don't want to have a racial bias yourself, but it doesn't mean you need to ignore the fact that (in this hypothetical) the vast majority of Chin…

During WW2, there was an internment camp called Manzanar, where the US put all the Japanese, even those with full American citizenship, simply because they were Japanese.

This does nothing to address GP's point.

GP: "What if the data actually shows 95% of Chinese people will break US law when given the chance?"

You: "Did you know there used to be Japanese internment camps?"

I think this is an interesting article that discusses what "racism" means in society today:

https://slatestarcodex.com/2017/06/21/against-murderism/

Re: Building China's Comac C919 airplane involved a lot of hacking, report says

#110

Post by ddiq »

djsumdog wrote: post #103
ddiq wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Racial profiling is just a slur for pattern recognition. If it turns out that 95% of Chinese scholars in the US are more loyal to China than to America, and that when given a chance, will illegally send information back to China, what are you supposed to do? It's fine if you don't want to have a racial bias yourself, but it doesn't mean you need to ignore the fact that (in this hypothetical) the vast majority of Chin…

During WW2, there was an internment camp called Manzanar, where the US put all the Japanese, even those with full American citizenship, simply because they were Japanese.

It's a perfectly reasonable stance in a war. Better to have 10,000 people interned than to risk a few more Takeo Yoshikawas running around.
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