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New rules for contractors have unexpected consequences for strip clubs

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Re: New rules for contractors have unexpected consequences for strip clubs

#31

Post by taberiand »

LanceH wrote: post #8
crooked-v wrote: post #4

The "traditional" standard here is for strippers to obviously be employees but get called contractors to evade paperwork, taxes, and required employee benefits, which is exactly the kind of situation these new standards are intended to prevent. I don't see anything "unexpected" about the result.

Not disagreeing, but the article mentioned the element of being an employee and getting assigned work rather than getting to pick and choose. The tax situation could be cleaned up without making them employees.

Sounds to me like the dancers should form a union to fight against those kind of employer requirements.

Re: New rules for contractors have unexpected consequences for strip clubs

#32

Post by CydeWeys »

kelnos wrote: post #10

Essentially what's happening is that now the club owners have to pay a bunch of taxes they managed to avoid paying before. The dancers themselves were likely not paying as much in taxes as they were supposed to, but now, with paycheck withholding, they're probably paying more in taxes than they used to. The clubs, in order to compensate for all the "new" taxes, are only paying minimum wage, and are taking larger cuts…

I doubt that most strip clubs will be unprofitable now. What I think is closer to the truth is that they were previously obscenely profitable, thanks in part to exploiting dancers and evading taxes, and will now be "merely" profitable along the same lines as any other service-based small business like a bar or restaurant.

Re: New rules for contractors have unexpected consequences for strip clubs

#33

Post by ultrarunner »

CydeWeys wrote: post #3

"This whole business will be completely ruined. The whole point about being a stripper is you go in, get fast cash, no one knows how you’re getting it, it’s not documented and it’s not taken from you." Sorry not sorry that you have to actually start paying taxes on your income like the rest of us. Some of these quotes are really helping to make the case for the law.

> Sorry not sorry that you have to actually start paying taxes on your income like the rest of us

I am. Paying taxes on income (that is then taxed again when spent) is a terrible disincentive. Some states agree with me; I would rather see the standard move toward a model free of income taxation than toward universal taxation. Doubly so when the tone of your comment seems to point to the motivation being largely spite.

Re: New rules for contractors have unexpected consequences for strip clubs

#34

Post by briffle »

dghughes wrote: post #11

Where did all the money go? If the dancers made hundreds of dollars as independent contractors wouldn't it have been tips from customers? Wouldn't the dancers still get the same amount but now also $15/hour plus benefits?

I think the point of the article was that they used to get hundreds of dollars in CASH. they then had some fees they had to pay to the club, etc.. and they were contractors, so they got a 1099 for the transactions the club had on its record. Now that they need to pay a wage, ALL cash comes to the club, and then they get a percentage of it back as commissions. This means ALL of the cash is now accounted for, making their tax liability much, much higher, because its actually getting reported .

Re: New rules for contractors have unexpected consequences for strip clubs

#35

Post by dominotw »

CydeWeys wrote: post #32
kelnos wrote: post #10

Essentially what's happening is that now the club owners have to pay a bunch of taxes they managed to avoid paying before. The dancers themselves were likely not paying as much in taxes as they were supposed to, but now, with paycheck withholding, they're probably paying more in taxes than they used to. The clubs, in order to compensate for all the "new" taxes, are only paying minimum wage, and are taking larger cuts…

I doubt that most strip clubs will be unprofitable now. What I think is closer to the truth is that they were previously obscenely profitable, thanks in part to exploiting dancers and evading taxes, and will now be "merely" profitable along the same lines as any other service-based small business like a bar or restaurant.

> were previously obscenely profitable

How can that be. Wouldn't that simply increase the supply of strip clubs, from more getting into something thats that profitable.

Re: New rules for contractors have unexpected consequences for strip clubs

#36

Post by TheRealDunkirk »

rolltiide wrote: post #16
CydeWeys wrote: post #3

"This whole business will be completely ruined. The whole point about being a stripper is you go in, get fast cash, no one knows how you’re getting it, it’s not documented and it’s not taken from you." Sorry not sorry that you have to actually start paying taxes on your income like the rest of us. Some of these quotes are really helping to make the case for the law.

But that doesn’t explain why their comp is fixed at the minimum wage of $15/hr This article is a year old.

Didn't notice that. This is a perfect opportunity to see how it's worked out in practice. How's business going for this 10-of-12-strip-clubs-in-the-city company?

Re: New rules for contractors have unexpected consequences for strip clubs

#37

Post by kryogen1c »

Look, i get the "sorry not sorry welcome to life like the rest of us" attitude. its true - but there is more truth.

certainly there are skeezy strip joints that take advantage of women without options and do more harm than good, but others could have been a way out. we just locked all the parachutes because some (probably most) people were joyriding with them, but this does greater than zero harm. _some_ people needed those parachutes and couldve changed their life.

im not saying this change is wrong. if you kill your enemy you would kill him again given the chance, but he was still someones son. something good was lost here.

edited a half dozen times before any replies because my brain is mush

Re: New rules for contractors have unexpected consequences for strip clubs

#38

Post by TheRealDunkirk »

kelnos wrote: post #10

Essentially what's happening is that now the club owners have to pay a bunch of taxes they managed to avoid paying before. The dancers themselves were likely not paying as much in taxes as they were supposed to, but now, with paycheck withholding, they're probably paying more in taxes than they used to. The clubs, in order to compensate for all the "new" taxes, are only paying minimum wage, and are taking larger cuts…

> If they want to keep their dancers from quitting, they'll likely have to raise prices enough to get a similar amount of cash into the hands of their dancers, while also meeting their tax obligations.

Like people always say, when corporate taxes are discussed (and now I'm guilty of it too): companies don't pay taxes; consumers do.

Re: New rules for contractors have unexpected consequences for strip clubs

#39

Post by EdwardDiego »

crooked-v wrote: post #4

The "traditional" standard here is for strippers to obviously be employees but get called contractors to evade paperwork, taxes, and required employee benefits, which is exactly the kind of situation these new standards are intended to prevent. I don't see anything "unexpected" about the result.

Yep, it's very common. "You're an independent contractor, but if you sleep with any of our customers for money[1], we'll 'fine' you $2000, and you can't work for anyone else"

[1]Prostitution is legal in my country.

Re: New rules for contractors have unexpected consequences for strip clubs

#40

Post by mikeryan »

CydeWeys wrote: post #30
rolltiide wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But that doesn’t explain why their comp is fixed at the minimum wage of $15/hr This article is a year old.

That's not at all uncommon for jobs that make a lot of money in tips. The minimum wage for servers is $2-something, for example. Even more so than servers, strippers are a tip-based job.

Not sure why you’re downvoted except in CA there’s no minimum wage exemption for servers. At least not when I was one.
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