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Restricting Manhattan’s 14th street to buses has been a success

nytimes.com

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Re: Restricting Manhattan’s 14th street to buses has been a success

#121

Post by fishingisfun »

hoorayimhelping wrote: post #108
Wowfunhappy wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, it hasn't caused the immediate armageddon some were predicting. It may be early yet, but realistically, what catastrophes do you foresee that wouldn't have come by now?

In the six years I lived in NYC proper, there was a giant flood, a giant power outage, several hurricanes, several blizzards, several city-wide protests, and countless large events taking place on the streets. That's just a few events I thought of off the top of my head. That doesn't cover the normal ebb and flow of activity in the city - it's pretty busy around Thanksgiving and Christmas, and dead in February, and a…

not even a month

Re: Restricting Manhattan’s 14th street to buses has been a success

#122

Post by anonu »

Tiktaalik wrote: post #94

The tech industry is floating all these complex technological ideas so solve traffic congestion, from apps that track traffic, to ride hailing to autonomous cars, but the reality is that traffic congestion is not a tech problem but rather a simple physics problem (and political problem). The core issue is simply that cars physically take up too much space on the road, and move too few passengers. This simple physics…

The work of Robert Moses is slowly getting undone. He left a major imprint on NYC, building infrastructure to support the automobile. For Moses, the car was the great middle class equalizer.

The result is NYC has 2 highways going up and down it's waterfront when it could have focused on integrating it's city on the rivers as opposed to using them to funnel cars into Manhattan.

Re: Restricting Manhattan’s 14th street to buses has been a success

#123

Post by anonu »

kspacewalk2 wrote: post #103
Silverwood wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I visited 14th street yesterday and was amazed by the change. I'm hoping that the city stops offering free street parking next.

Free street parking in Manhattan. Can anything be more ludicrous and unfair?

Not sure if your comment is sarcastic. But free is a major mispricing by the city. All you need to do is go to the garage next door to see that they charge $40 for the day.

The streets are a public good and they should be for cyclists and pedestrians.

Re: Restricting Manhattan’s 14th street to buses has been a success

#124

Post by freeone3000 »

rubyboss wrote: post #61
NeedMoreTea wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even when I briefly worked in London in the 90s there was no point having the car. I am truly puzzled so many locals bothered. Uber or cab should only need to be occasional - there is great, albeit crowded public transport. It was entirely counter-productive, slower than cycling, expensive and just about zero chance of convenient parking. After one or two attempts, I left it at home and took the train down each week.

I take public transport or cycle to work every day as I work in the City and it's faster and more convenient. People should be inspired to take public transport instead of driving because it's better and faster to do so, not restricted by levying giant taxes and blocking roads.

These are comparative measures - you can make public transit better and faster by making driving expensive and worse, even if public transit doesn't improve.

Re: Restricting Manhattan’s 14th street to buses has been a success

#125

Post by randallsquared »

amarshall wrote: post #111
randallsquared wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I just don't understand this. I moved to Manhattan last year, and while there some things I've been annoyed about, it wouldn't have occurred to me to put "cars" on that list. I didn't bring my car here, and having driven a rental a couple times in the city, it's hard for me to imagine why anyone drives here if they don't have to: the experience as a driver is far, far worse than as a pedestrian.

Cars are noisy (engines, superfluous horns) and lower air quality. They often drive aggressively and are a hazard to bicyclists and pedestrians. They cause congestion, slowing buses that are vastly more space-efficient. Look at some of “urban plazas” [1] that have replaced short sections of road and witness how much more peaceful and open the city can feel when roads are removed in favor of people. Or, go down to 14t…

Yeah, sorry, those reasons make total sense. But,

> The thought of how pleasant Manhattan would become if only cabs + busses + delivery trucks + ambulances were allowed makes me almost too happy.

was the part that made no sense. Cabs are at least as noisy and air-quality-deficient as other cars, and there will be a lot more of them if other cars are banned from some large part of Manhattan.

As a pedestrian (which is every day), I've never felt as threatened by cars as I did when I was driving a rental in NYC, which happened only a couple times.

Re: Restricting Manhattan’s 14th street to buses has been a success

#126

Post by astanway »

megaremote wrote: post #77
gpm wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't understand why "cabs" is an allowed exception here. Cabs are like cars, except more expensive, and they drive around without anyone using them for transport looking for business. Why are they superior? I'm picking on this example not because I think that list is meant to be complete or perfectly thought out, but because cabs often seem to get exceptions like this (e.g. in HOV lanes) and I really don't underst…

And, they are often the worst drivers in any city.

That's really false. They are professional drivers, it's much safer to bike around them as opposed to regular people who don't understand how NYC streets work.

Re: Restricting Manhattan’s 14th street to buses has been a success

#127

Post by ascagnel_ »

thebradbain wrote: post #17
Wowfunhappy wrote: post #3

As far as I'm concerned, cars have no place in Manhattan, and should be banned from all but a handful of designated roads. Maybe give out special licenses to the disabled, or anyone else who physically requires a car—that way, they'll actually be able to get around at reasonable speeds, too.

Instead of an outright ban, I'd love to see price-prohibitive congestion pricing and street-parking pricing (prohibitive in the sense that it wouldn't make financial sense to drive a car as the primary mode of transport, not that if someone needed to occasionally use a car they couldn't) within Manhattan, with the aforementioned provisions carved out for those who demonstrate a need for a car. That way, for any of th…

I love this idea — it really just needs to be expensive enough to make commuting by public transit a better option than by car. There are too many one-off cases where you’d need a car (for one anecdotal example, having to drive a family member home after surgery was an uncommon case where I drove into Manhattan, instead of taking public transit) to make a total ban workable without seriously disrupting people’s lives in other ways.

Re: Restricting Manhattan’s 14th street to buses has been a success

#129

Post by neilv »

thebradbain wrote: post #17
Wowfunhappy wrote: post #3

As far as I'm concerned, cars have no place in Manhattan, and should be banned from all but a handful of designated roads. Maybe give out special licenses to the disabled, or anyone else who physically requires a car—that way, they'll actually be able to get around at reasonable speeds, too.

Instead of an outright ban, I'd love to see price-prohibitive congestion pricing and street-parking pricing (prohibitive in the sense that it wouldn't make financial sense to drive a car as the primary mode of transport, not that if someone needed to occasionally use a car they couldn't) within Manhattan, with the aforementioned provisions carved out for those who demonstrate a need for a car. That way, for any of th…

> price-prohibitive congestion pricing and street-parking pricing [...] That way, for any of those stubborn and wealthy enough who refuse to use public transit, we can direct all funds generated to improving public transit*

That seems to hand the shared public resource to the wealthy. (Regardless of whether you envision the revenue being used to someday provide a comparably attractive option for the non-wealthy.)

Re: Restricting Manhattan’s 14th street to buses has been a success

#130

Post by danielharan »

jshaqaw wrote: post #87

I’m torn on the cars in Manhattan debate. I live my whole city life on public transport. I hate the pollution of cars and I hate how perilous it is for my kids to cross the streets. At the same time we sometimes do want to or have to travel outside the city. I’m not really sure how that would work in a car free city.

You could have parking with rental cars on the periphery of the city or its car-free zone.
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