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UN Security Council Holds Closed Hearing on Turkey: Syria Update

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Re: UN Security Council Holds Closed Hearing on Turkey: Syria Update

#131
post #126
post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I appreciate the effort you've been making to inch a bit closer toward the intended use of the site. I hope it isn't too annoying if I say so. The tag HN uses is not [removed] but [deleted] and yes, if the post has no children, we don't bother displaying that. It's just there as a placeholder in comment trees. More importantly, though: mods never delete posts unless the author asks us to. The most we would do is kill…

>I appreciate the effort you've been making to inch a bit closer toward the intended use of the site. I hope it isn't too annoying if I say so. Absolutely not, and I appreciate what you do. It's very uncommon to see someone with the necessary set of skills to effectively maintain a community and put up with people like me. That also includes calmly explaining over and over again the decisions that have to be taken to…

Thanks for that. If there are things we could do differently that you think would be more effective, I'd like to know what they are.

Re: UN Security Council Holds Closed Hearing on Turkey: Syria Update

#132
post #119
post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

a reply to this was just removed. not [removed] removed, but actually deleted. Is that normal? I've never seen that.

I was the author of that message and I removed it myself (it was a troll reply that got flagged). Removed posts appear as [removed] only if they have children (and, I believe, only mods can remove posts that have children). A post with no children that is removed by its author or a mod simply vanishes.

I didn't know that, thanks

Re: UN Security Council Holds Closed Hearing on Turkey: Syria Update

#133

What EU should immediately do is to start building charter cities. Either on sparsely populated areas within EU or by making long term rental agreements outside EU. Or likely both. The rules of charter cities would be roughly as follows: - Anyone (literally anyone) would be welcome to move to charter city if they just want so. - EU guarantees funding for basic infrastructure like education, legal system, security, he…

So basically a long worded definition of ghetto. It hasn't worked in the past.

Re: UN Security Council Holds Closed Hearing on Turkey: Syria Update

#134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would Germans have had an opinion at all on Kurds? Were there a number that immigrated there in the 70s or earlier?

There's other reasons to have opinions about populations being systematically oppresssed besides them being immigrants (or refugees).

Opinions derived from what? Personal experience? The media? History books?

Re: UN Security Council Holds Closed Hearing on Turkey: Syria Update

#135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would Germans have had an opinion at all on Kurds? Were there a number that immigrated there in the 70s or earlier?

Mainly because there are so many Turkish workers in Germany and they were in-fighting with the Kurds way back when, some of it spilled over and there was some violence in Germany.

I see, thanks for explaining.

Re: UN Security Council Holds Closed Hearing on Turkey: Syria Update

#136
post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

America.

This is a very bad example. America is a completely different story as it is a stitched up nation (for lack of better words) from it's very inception and the societal and cultural dynamics are very different from those in Europe. Please don't try to force American solutions to non-American problems. Furthermore, the US currently is a lot more xenophobic and less accepting of foreigners than Europe is. I'd even go as…

There's no fundamental reason why America's ability to integrate cultures couldn't be replicated in Europe. It's just a cultural choice not to. There's not any excuse for it.

Just like the current xenophobic attitudes among some in the US is a choice and was a choice in the past. None of this is excusable, none of it is inevitable. And I have little patience for "realists" who carry water for the idea that xenophobia is inevitable and unchangeable.

And not that it matters to the discussion of whether it's inevitable or not, but Americans are more welcoming of immigrants: https://www.nytimes.com/2015/12/09/business/international/fo... and have lower demonstrated racism than most of Europe: https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2013/05/15...

Re: UN Security Council Holds Closed Hearing on Turkey: Syria Update

#137
post #109
post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wanted to reply "Wasn't it mostly while it was sparsely populated and expanding?", but decided to check numbers first. You are right! https://www.dhs.gov/immigration-statistics/yearbook/2017/tab...

Again, a very different situation. First of all, these numbers are still very minuscule compared to the total population and territory of the USA - for example the UK alone accepted a little over 200k non-eu immigrants in 2018. Secondly, these new citizens are truly multicultural, as they literally come from every part of the globe - opposed to the refugees coming into the EU who are mostly from a middle eastern cult…

The idea that "new immigrants coming into the US rarely have the luxury of arriving in a group of people similar to them" is wrong both currently and historically.

This is making excuses for a cultural choice.

Re: UN Security Council Holds Closed Hearing on Turkey: Syria Update

#138
post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

America.

This is a very bad example. America is a completely different story as it is a stitched up nation (for lack of better words) from it's very inception and the societal and cultural dynamics are very different from those in Europe. Please don't try to force American solutions to non-American problems. Furthermore, the US currently is a lot more xenophobic and less accepting of foreigners than Europe is. I'd even go as…

Wait - America is almost entirely peopled with folks from other countries. What magical transformation occurred when they moved to a different continent, that made Americans suddenly different? Our solutions are not somehow incompatible with European people, since many of us are, originally, from there.

And forget the anecdotal data. The bulk of Americans interact with folks from all around the world, daily, with little issue. America's a big place, and its easy to cherry-pick news reports to get any impression you like.

Here's some data: racism by demonstrated tolerance. America is at the bottom of the list:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2013/05/15...

Re: UN Security Council Holds Closed Hearing on Turkey: Syria Update

#139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So, one of the countries which has increased Nazi/Ultra-nationalist votes in the recent years? pick any :D literally. Europe with the very small percentage of refugees taken in, per capita, has already went full on ultra nationalist, even in places like Sweden. So, we should be more fair to Turkey handling literally, not metaphorically, millions of refugees. It is easy to talk about humanitarian values, when you're o…

I know right?! These damn European Nazis, giving refugees free food, free housing, free top medical care, free education out of their own taxes. Shame on them! /s Oh, you mean discrimination? I'm white, Eastern European living in Western Europe and if I'd have a biscuit for every time I have been discriminated here I'd be fat for life. And yet, I don't call everyone who doesn't like me a nazi.

Well, I am white and Eastern Europe too. I don't mind countries refusing to take in refugees. I just don't like the hypocrisy and virtue signaling. Turkey is just being very direct and open, instead of virtue-signaling and keeping face acting "humanitarian". Yet this same country holds most amount of refugees in comparison. Maybe, they know a thing or two about the whole ordeal.
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