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Zettelkästen?

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31–40 of 92 posts

Re: Zettelkästen?

#31
post #24

I had the realization yesterday while waiting for a train that the Notes app on iOS contains all the functionality I'd need in order to be able to build a small organization/business .. as long as I standardized my form of note-taking and rigorously applied policies on how Notes are transformed from one Folder to the other - and on what conditions I send the Notes to others using Airdrop. In other words, all I really…

I've thought similar things about ancient empires, or even pre-computerized ones. The Roman Empire managed a territory nearly 10x larger than any individual modern European country and yet they only had parchment, papyrus, and wax tablets.

Re: Zettelkästen?

#33
My father used to have a gigantic collection of index cards when he worked as a professor at a high school for librarians. We're talking about 100,000 cards or more. When he had to give a seminar session about topic X, he just selected a bunch of cards from his well-ordered, beautiful wooden storage boxes, fastened them with a rubber band, and took them for work. They contained references, small summaries, newspaper articles, keywords, etc.

I tried to use the same system but never had the patience to implement it - and the digital versus analogue divide also prevented it, because this works best if you use only digital or only analogue. Index cards and a database don't work well together.

Edit: Maybe important, and I forget to mention it: All of my attempts of replicating such a system on the computer have failed, and I have never heard of anyone in Academia who successfully used a digital system throughout their career. #1 Reason of failure is that the database format or program became obsolete, #2 Database/Systems Migration problems.

Re: Zettelkästen?

#35

My father used to have a gigantic collection of index cards when he worked as a professor at a high school for librarians. We're talking about 100,000 cards or more. When he had to give a seminar session about topic X, he just selected a bunch of cards from his well-ordered, beautiful wooden storage boxes, fastened them with a rubber band, and took them for work. They contained references, small summaries, newspaper…

There are many people who succeed with simple textfiles as a digital solution. Nowadays there are also many building up on this, adding more complexity by using markup languages like markdown or org-mode, and building tools around this.

Digital only really fails at some point if you wanna utilize the full power of computers, and go full database, automation and complex architectures. Which is kinda paradox.

Re: Zettelkästen?

#36
post #26

There's an open-source WYSIWYG Markdown editor named Zettlr, the author of which is very fond of the Zettelkasten method and seems to provide some features meant to help with it: https://www.zettlr.com/ I don't know much about Zettelkasten, but I used this app as a Markdown editor of choice for some time until I discovered Marktext.

Wow that looks really neat! Too bad that there seems to be no Webclient, although it seems to be a Webapp (based on Electron) ... Last weekend I hacked a tiny WYSIWG flat-file HTML wiki for documenting a small hobby project with a non-coder friend, but now Zettlr looks like all I ever wished for, for that purpose. Except I would've to bug my buddy to install the Zettlr applciation as well.

Re: Zettelkästen?

#37

My father used to have a gigantic collection of index cards when he worked as a professor at a high school for librarians. We're talking about 100,000 cards or more. When he had to give a seminar session about topic X, he just selected a bunch of cards from his well-ordered, beautiful wooden storage boxes, fastened them with a rubber band, and took them for work. They contained references, small summaries, newspaper…

I think going plaintext might be the best way here.

I wonder, though... I think writing something by hand gives a different feel for it. I don't know how to explain it. It's like your mind works better if you write by hand.

So maybe an app, used with a stylus on a tablet or large-ish phone might be the best combination? It should then create folders and textfiles, and just store the text there. Which would require OCR and proofreading, of course. But that shouldn't be an issue.

Re: Zettelkästen?

#39
post #30

I actually was just at a small meetup for people in the SF Bay Area who are building memex's. The Zettelkasten was a common theme in several of the projects people were working on. Here are my notes from the event for anyone interested: http://ceasarbautista.com/posts/memex_meetup_2.html There are a couple projects that came up that were loosely based on the Zettelkasten: - IdeaFlow by Jacob Cole - Roam Research by C…

Cool recap. From your article:

> Is there a general interchange format for these systems?

I don't understand why none of these people is using RDF. Seems like a perfect technology for a memex.

Re: Zettelkästen?

#40

My father used to have a gigantic collection of index cards when he worked as a professor at a high school for librarians. We're talking about 100,000 cards or more. When he had to give a seminar session about topic X, he just selected a bunch of cards from his well-ordered, beautiful wooden storage boxes, fastened them with a rubber band, and took them for work. They contained references, small summaries, newspaper…

I've been using a system like that successfully as an academic (for some interpretation of successful). Started when I was a PhD student 25 years ago, and have been maintaining it ever since. I was inspired by Niklas Luhmann's Zettelkasten, whom I read voraciously as a teenager. I started as an undergraduate with hand-written index cards, but the obvious advantages of electronic files (fast search, cut/paste, easy backup, doesn't need physical space) were immediately clear to me, so I moved to a computer-based system. As I had already been burned by proprietary formats before, I use html as format from day one, every index card is html file in a separate directory. This has various advantages, including

- Easy consistent styling through css

- No WYSIWYG, separation of content and styling

- Easy to include code, which sits in the directory associated with the index card

- Easy to cross link

- Easy to backup

- Everything is under git control

- Easy to write shell scripts / programs that automate various tasks related to my notes

- Search with standard tools like grep

- Edit in my favourite text editor (Org-mode for quick drafting is especially useful I find)

- High quality rendering through modern browsers

- Easy to cut and paste into emails, whatsapp skype discord etc which is how I communicate with students and colleagues

- Easy to include other formats like images sound video etc

- Since the emergence of MathJax I can use LaTeX markup which means I can cut-and-paste between my index cards, scientific papers and lecture notes/slides

In summary, I'm super glad I didn't go super-hi-tech and stuck with marked-up text. It was the right choice! As Graydon Hoare once wrote: "[A]lways bet on text." How much work is it? I spend 1-2 hours on average every day on writing. Is it worth my time? What are the advantages for me that keep me using such a system?

- Structured, easily accessible 'idea store' / second-memory for later refinement and reuse. Refinement is maybe even the core: when I come back to a subject years later I come back from a different angle

- Helps writing introductory sections in papers, because I will have sketched my understanding of a subject already on an index card

- Helps writing related work sections in papers, because I accumulate work related to any particular index card's subjects over years

- Makes reviewing papers much easier, because I can cut-and-paste missing related work (most scientific papers are written by PhD students and post-docs who lack a historical perspective)

- Communicating with students: as an academic I get new students every year, and since they got through similar stages and problems, it has become easy to reuse what I wrote in paste years

- The most important: cultivating a habit of writing down ideas, writing about ideas in a structured way, breaking them down into smaller parts etc, all of which helps me to understand things better, and to communicate them more clearly to others

Is it worth it? I ask myself this question every day. I found that in the first few years, I could always remember what I had written, so my system was of limited use. That changed after about 8 years, when I could no longer recall most of what I had written down, and then it became rather useful, since I got 'new' and already pre-digested ideas.

For me the biggest problem is that it has also become a procrastination device: I love writing. Whenever I am stuck with a work problem (and that happens a lot), I have a tendency to procrastinate by writing long entries on obscure subjects, unrelated to my work. It feels like work, in some sense it is work, but it lets me avoid confronting high-priority tasks head on.

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