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The Isle of Man is not in the UK

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Re: The Isle of Man is not in the UK

#151

Post by pjc50 »

pytester wrote: post #148
cgiles wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have watched Brexit avidly but comfortably from across the pond for the last two years. Every PMQs Corbyn has got up and, in the earlier days, ignored Brexit entirely, and now, he complains about lack of clarity and progress by the Government. While he and his party have never had any clear position on it, by design. The Tories' current position of hard Brexit or bust may be insane, but at least it is a position. T…

>While he and his party have never had any clear position on it, by design. Their position is to negotiate another deal (if possible) and put it to a public vote, and put the existing deal to a vote if not. It's pretty clear albeit not so easy to understand for the perennially simple minded (for whom simple messages like "remain at all costs" and "we must execute the glorious brexit revolution on october 31st" appeal…

> Their position is to negotiate another deal (if possible) and put it to a public vote

That's not really much more information - revoke if the deal is not accepted? What do they actually want from the deal? What is the party's true desired outcome, being in the EU or not being in the EU?

It's very hard to form an accurate picture of Corbyn. I can't think of anything impressive he's done, and he's doing tremendously badly in the polls against a disaster government - but all the media coverage is so heavily slanted against him that I'm reluctant to form a negative opinion that's clearly being indoctrinated into me.

Re: The Isle of Man is not in the UK

#152

Post by pjc50 »

tristanperry wrote: post #130
NeedMoreTea wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Had Cameron taken this approach, things could have worked out OK for the UK. Every one of those involved renegotiation and change of treaties before a re-vote. The timeline could have been: Cameron attempts to renegotiate with EU, achieves little. Calls a referendum, leave achieves a very narrow margin. Cameron doesn't resign, but attempts to renegotiate with the EU, achieves some small but significant improvements.…

Good point - I agree, and I'm really disappointed it didn't play out like that. Instead the UK has had political stalemate for 3.5 years and even now it doesn't look like we're closer to 'a deal'.

I don't think a renegotiation after the referendum could possibly have achieved anything. Discourse about the EU in the UK is not based on facts. The EU would never have given compromises on freedom of movement, or the single market, and there wasn't anything else specific that people were asking for.

Re: The Isle of Man is not in the UK

#153

Post by adolph »

peteretep wrote: post #15

Isle of Man has zero percent corporate tax on (most) money earned outside the Isle of Man, which includes money earned in the UK. If you're a non-resident citizen of the UK, you can deposit your dividends from your Isle of Man company in your UK bank account, tax free. For the time being, IOM companies have GB VAT numbers, and a banking system that integrates seamlessly with the UK one, as well as a postal system (qu…

HMRC: Her Majesty's Revenue and Customs (HM Revenue and Customs or HMRC)[3] is a non-ministerial department of the UK Government responsible for the collection of taxes, the payment of some forms of state support and the administration of other regulatory regimes including the national minimum wage.

Re: The Isle of Man is not in the UK

#154

Post by cgiles »

pytester wrote: post #148
cgiles wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have watched Brexit avidly but comfortably from across the pond for the last two years. Every PMQs Corbyn has got up and, in the earlier days, ignored Brexit entirely, and now, he complains about lack of clarity and progress by the Government. While he and his party have never had any clear position on it, by design. The Tories' current position of hard Brexit or bust may be insane, but at least it is a position. T…

>While he and his party have never had any clear position on it, by design. Their position is to negotiate another deal (if possible) and put it to a public vote, and put the existing deal to a vote if not. It's pretty clear albeit not so easy to understand for the perennially simple minded (for whom simple messages like "remain at all costs" and "we must execute the glorious brexit revolution on october 31st" appeal…

> Their position is to negotiate another deal (if possible) and put it to a public vote, and put the existing deal to a vote if not.

Yes, but even this very unclear proposition is a recent invention (last 3 months IIRC). Before that they had nothing. For 2+ years.

> Unfortunately it isn't possible to make promises about what will be possible to negotiate with the EU.

True enough -- to a point. But he could say what the general outline of the UK's goals in the negotiations will be and how the strategy/objectives/redlines will differ from TM's and Boris's.

At this point without specifics, we can all be forgiven for assuming it is more unicorn horns and pixie dust. Does "I'm going to go to Brussels and get a deal, a great deal" sound at all familiar by now? I am surprised anyone buys it at this point.

He cannot say for certain how the EU will respond to any proposal, although honestly Barnier has been crystal clear about what is required of the UK and what the options are.

And does Corbyn even know the difference between the Single Market and Customs Union? I have seen no indication that he does.

> Unfortunately London forgetting that the rest of the country exists

Going for a soft Brexit would be a compromise between the rural areas of England and Wales, who want to leave the EU entirely at any cost, and Scotland and NI (and Gibraltar), who want to remain. I would say it is the strategy that takes most into account the rest of the country in its entirety.

Whether or not such a stance would be to Labour's electoral advantage is anyone's guess. They have apparently concluded it would not be.

In fact the EU has been essentially forcing England to listen to the rest of the country -- NI, specificially. Which is quite ironic.

Re: The Isle of Man is not in the UK

#155

Post by conjectures »

Stay_frostJebel wrote: post #86

> “Independence is a strong part of the character of the people of the island. We’re not part of the UK, or the British Isles – we’re Manx,” said Phil Gawne, a former politician on the island... Hmm. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Isles > The British Isles are a group of islands in the North Atlantic off the north-western coast of continental Europe that consist of the islands of Great Britain, Ireland, the Is…

Let me translate that for you:

“Independence is a strong part of the character of the people of the island. We’re whatever it takes to remain a tax haven.”

Re: The Isle of Man is not in the UK

#156

Post by cgiles »

pjc50 wrote: post #151
pytester wrote: post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>While he and his party have never had any clear position on it, by design. Their position is to negotiate another deal (if possible) and put it to a public vote, and put the existing deal to a vote if not. It's pretty clear albeit not so easy to understand for the perennially simple minded (for whom simple messages like "remain at all costs" and "we must execute the glorious brexit revolution on october 31st" appeal…

> Their position is to negotiate another deal (if possible) and put it to a public vote That's not really much more information - revoke if the deal is not accepted? What do they actually want from the deal? What is the party's true desired outcome, being in the EU or not being in the EU? It's very hard to form an accurate picture of Corbyn. I can't think of anything impressive he's done, and he's doing tremendously…

> What do they actually want from the deal?

The conventional wisdom is that the party is split between Remainers and Leavers, and that Corbyn himself is a closet Leaver who wants to leave so he can get out from under EU rules on state aid and bring about a glorious socialist revolution.

If this is remotely true, then Corbyn's personal aim is to help the Tories to a no-deal Brexit, or even a hard Brexit under the WA, but in such a way that Labour does not get the blame. However, much of the party wants a soft Brexit or Remain so he cannot be seen to be doing this.

Hence why he does not want, and never has wanted, to obtain Government until Brexit has been sorted (badly) by the Tories, and to come along and pick up the pieces. The entire Labour strategy has been to completely disassociate themselves from Brexit and this latest non-proposal is just a continuation of that.

> What is the party's true desired outcome, being in the EU or not being in the EU?

In short, they do not know and are split. The only thing they agree on is not being blamed for either Remain, soft Leave, or hard Leave. And whoever is in power when the final decision is made most certainly will get blame for any decision taken.

Re: The Isle of Man is not in the UK

#157

Post by benj111 »

marcus_holmes wrote: post #119
VBprogrammer wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At a guess this might not be far from the truth. For sub a few hundred pound almost no one would bother fighting it. Above a few hundred thousand almost everyone will. At best they'd have to expend a lot of time and money to get a fraction of the original amount back.

My wealthy great aunt paid an accountant to minimise her tax bill. She said it worked out around even, the costs of the accountant were about what she saved on the taxes, but she preferred paying the accountant than the government.

"but she preferred paying the accountant"

Why?

At the extreme, would she have preferred to pay 100% to accountants rather than the government?

If everyone took that view, who would pay for the schools and roads etc? I suppose that wouldn't happen, the tax rate would be increased, so everyone's paying tax and a massive accountants bill, so really the rational move is to pay the tax.

Re: The Isle of Man is not in the UK

#158

Post by jermaustin1 »

peteretep wrote: post #107
simonh wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unless you’re an American living abroad, in which case it’s tax evasion.

For that, there's FEIE, and moving your residence to Puerto Rico

FEIE phases out at just over $100k for singles, $200k for marrieds, and then you are taxed at the typical bracket for earnings in excess of.

Keeping things in USD for simplicity then converting at the end.

So say you live in the UK, and you + spouse earn $350k USD, UK will tax just under 40%, but lets go ahead and round it to 40%, then the US will tax the $150k at 24% to $315k and 32% to $350k.

So back of napkin calculations, your take home in the UK will be $210k and then you owe the US another $40k, making your total take home in GBP as of today, 140k.

Re: The Isle of Man is not in the UK

#159

Post by benj111 »

cgiles wrote: post #144
pytester wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>his bum's going to be full of splinters... This particular talking point was kicked off and repeated frequently by the two newspapers who are owned by notorious tax avoiders - mail and telegraph. It then filtered down to the rest of the population. They're also the two who are most pro brexit.

I have watched Brexit avidly but comfortably from across the pond for the last two years. Every PMQs Corbyn has got up and, in the earlier days, ignored Brexit entirely, and now, he complains about lack of clarity and progress by the Government. While he and his party have never had any clear position on it, by design. The Tories' current position of hard Brexit or bust may be insane, but at least it is a position. T…

We have a divided country, and the only party capable of bridging the gap is Labour. The Tories position is as divisive and unhelpful as the Lib Dem's.

I'm not a particular Corbyn fan, but I'd like an intact nation at the end of this.

Re: The Isle of Man is not in the UK

#160

Post by toasterlovin »

pavlov wrote: post #129
simonh wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I hear this theory a lot, but the fact is most of the support for Brexit came from low income households, and people in low skilled or manual work. Generally the higher the household income, the lower the support for Brexit, even at the higher income levels. https://www.jrf.org.uk/report/brexit-vote-explained-poverty-...

Most of the support for Brexit came from tabloid newspapers owned by the ultra-rich. Polls in the 2010-15 timeframe consistently showed that Britain's European relationship didn't even make the top 5 of issues amongst voters. Consistently fewer than 6% listed Europe as their most important issue: https://ftalphaville.ft.com/2018/12/11/1544504400000/The-onl... Today more than 50% see Europe as the most important polit…

> Most of the support for Brexit came from tabloid newspapers owned by the ultra-rich.

Aren't most newspapers owned by the ultra-rich? Couldn't you just make the exact same arguments you leveled against your political opponents (that they were hoodwinked by "the media") against your own position? At the end of the day, people showed up and voted for something. Twice (basically). That means something.

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