Apple Removes HKmap.live from the App Store • Hacker News Board

Re: Apple Removes HKmap.live from the App Store

#331

Post by jm4 » Thu, Oct 10, 2019, 2:21 PM UTC

journalctl wrote: post #268

stephc_int13 wrote: post #261

Blizzard and now Apple. I think this is very serious and it should be a wake-up call. As simple citizens we don't have much choices but vote with our wallets and use social networks to attack the most valuable asset of those companies, their reputation.

That’s not how this works. Apple is one of the wealthiest companies in the world, and saying “just don’t spend money there” is a bit reductionist and trivializes the problem of corporations with more power than nation-states. You need to fight fire with fire: governments of the world (especially the US government) need to create laws that restrict and punish this kind of behavior. Otherwise, I sincerely doubt Apple’s…

How does that play out? The US and China would pass contradictory laws and then companies would have to choose which to follow. They will follow the money and we may not like the result.

Re: Apple Removes HKmap.live from the App Store

#332

Post by aldoushuxley001 » Thu, Oct 10, 2019, 2:21 PM UTC

elicash wrote: post #264

What's weird is that if you google: "Hong Kong" "Cybersecurity and Technology Crime Bureau" -apple You come up with surprisingly little. Basically two stories. One about preventing scams in Hong Kong, and one about fake checks. I was expecting tens of thousands of results. Is there a more common name that's used in English for this entity? I'd like to research more about who they are other than the generality of a wi…

Unfortunately google is barely a search engine anymore, try on DuckDuckGo and you’ll find more relevant results. That’s what happens when google switches from trying to give you the most relevant results to simply trying to spoon feed you what they want or don’t want you to know.

Re: Apple Removes HKmap.live from the App Store

#333

Post by idlewords » Thu, Oct 10, 2019, 2:22 PM UTC

adam12 wrote: post #318

Why does this have to be an app in the App store? I wonder what APIs they are using that can't be replaced by something that will work in the browser.

There's a browser app at https://hkmap.live. Having an app in the app store is useful backup, since there has been talk in Hong Kong of censoring the internet under emergency law.

Re: Apple Removes HKmap.live from the App Store

#334

Post by Wowfunhappy » Thu, Oct 10, 2019, 2:22 PM UTC

s_dev wrote: post #324

Wowfunhappy wrote: post #297

And in one fell swoop, Apple has made it effectively impossible to install this app on your phone. There's no realistic workaround. † Apple should never have been capable of making such a drastic decision for all of their customers. It's one thing to make determinations about what products are allowed in your store, but quite another to unilaterally ban software from what is many people's primary computer. We live in…

>And in one fell swoop, Apple has made it effectively impossible to install this app on your phone. There's no realistic workaround. Make the app a Web App and visit it in Safari. Apple has banned it being notarized and distributed from their App Store but iPhones still have access to the conventional web which Apple has no control over.

Apple has been (I suspect purposefully!) dragging their feet on progressive web app support. There list of limitations is long, but most critically for this app (I would imagine), they can't send notifications and they can't work offline.

Re: Apple Removes HKmap.live from the App Store

#335

Post by wnkrshm » Thu, Oct 10, 2019, 2:23 PM UTC

s_dev wrote: post #324

Wowfunhappy wrote: post #297

And in one fell swoop, Apple has made it effectively impossible to install this app on your phone. There's no realistic workaround. † Apple should never have been capable of making such a drastic decision for all of their customers. It's one thing to make determinations about what products are allowed in your store, but quite another to unilaterally ban software from what is many people's primary computer. We live in…

>And in one fell swoop, Apple has made it effectively impossible to install this app on your phone. There's no realistic workaround. Make the app a Web App and visit it in Safari. Apple has banned it being notarized and distributed from their App Store but iPhones still have access to the conventional web which Apple has no control over.

I wonder whether Hong Kong is behind the great firewall or not. Specifically, whether HK is behind it but the firewall is transparent for HK requests.

Re: Apple Removes HKmap.live from the App Store

#336

Post by Double_a_92 » Thu, Oct 10, 2019, 2:24 PM UTC

sho wrote: post #315

Here we go again... Let me explain how Chinese people think about HK, since none of them ever seem to explain it on a site like this. Imagine you are a middle class American. Maybe you are but if not, just imagine, tech city on the east or west coast. You're pretty invested in being an American, skin in the game, manifest destiny etc. Very good. They call this tianxia by the way, basically Chinese manifest destiny. L…

Wanting basic democracy and human rights is a bit different than wanting to "make nukes" or "marry your cousins"...

Re: Apple Removes HKmap.live from the App Store

#337

Post by metalchianti » Thu, Oct 10, 2019, 2:24 PM UTC

greatjack613 wrote: post #246

Honestly, I think we as in the United States have to think harder whether it is worth sacrificing our beliefs in freedom to gain a few $$$ (edit: A lot of $$$$$) from countries that don't provide their citizens with basic rights.

It's an interesting conundrum. Many values held by the US founding fathers were flawed (IMO due to the period's sentiment). But how would they feel about a globalized economy that is manipulated by a tyrannical force to infringe on liberties in the US?

Re: Apple Removes HKmap.live from the App Store

#338

Post by ccvannorman » Thu, Oct 10, 2019, 2:24 PM UTC

adam12 wrote: post #318

Why does this have to be an app in the App store? I wonder what APIs they are using that can't be replaced by something that will work in the browser.

Browser apps can't penetrate the Great China Firewall as China can simply ban the domain

Re: Apple Removes HKmap.live from the App Store

#339

Post by 0xffff2 » Thu, Oct 10, 2019, 2:25 PM UTC

ProAm wrote: post #265

stephc_int13 wrote: post #261

Blizzard and now Apple. I think this is very serious and it should be a wake-up call. As simple citizens we don't have much choices but vote with our wallets and use social networks to attack the most valuable asset of those companies, their reputation.

This isnt about free will, its a clear indication that the US is not the worlds most important economy anymore.

So far no one has had to choose. If the US started sanctioning US companies that took these kinds of actions, then we'd find out as companies either reversed their decisions or fled the US.

Re: Apple Removes HKmap.live from the App Store

#340

Post by idlewords » Thu, Oct 10, 2019, 2:25 PM UTC

dang wrote: post #137

idlewords wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think when the story is a suppression campaign, where you see the world's most powerful company do an about-face twice in three days because of political pressure, you should think carefully about the implications of your own decision to suppress coverage and discussion of the event (which I understand is done from unrelated motives). By your own logic, if China (god forbid) invades Hong Kong, there would be even m…

I appreciate the good faith in your comment! The point you're making about escalating crises seems to me to be covered by the 'significant new information' test that I've described elsewhere ( https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=false&qu... ). In the case of the current story, we're not suppressing coverage of it or discussion of it; it's the other way around. What is true, though, is that it sometime…

It sounds like you're understaffed, honestly.