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Forget philanthropy. The super-rich should be paying proper taxes

theguardian.com

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Re: Forget philanthropy. The super-rich should be paying proper taxes

#81

Post by marmadukester39 »

malvosenior wrote: post #53
AlexandrB wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Why the notion that gov't should be the provider & arbiter of all? Because the government is democratically elected. Billionaires are not. > Why do none of the "they don't pay enough taxes" crowd not realize the rich do so much of, and more efficiently, what the gov't purports to with massive overhead? [citation needed] In fact, there's an easy counter-example. Healthcare. More expensive than any public system, wit…

I trust politicians as much as I trust billionaires: not at all. In fact as the OP points out at least the occasional billionaire will do something productive for society. The same can't be said for the government. > [citation needed] In fact, there's an easy counter-example. Healthcare. More expensive than any public system, with worse outcomes for the general population. The only reason health care is so expensive…

So you want uncertified doctors, unvetted medications and health insurers to be able to do whatever they want to their captive customers. Got it.

Re: Forget philanthropy. The super-rich should be paying proper taxes

#83

Post by zpallin »

ctdonath wrote: post #8
grecy wrote: post #5

I just read that Jeff Bezoz will pay a lower tax rate than someone earning $7.25/hr. Incredible.

He's also giving thousands of people jobs, making necessities available to millions at low prices, and paying enormous amounts in total taxes. Can gov't really do more with his money than he can? Do you really want to disincentivize what he does for humanity?

What Jeff Bezos does for humanity: kill lots of small business owners, drive down wages, eliminate blue collar jobs, and amass entirely too much power and wealth for himself.

Yes, I would like to "disincentivize" this.

Re: Forget philanthropy. The super-rich should be paying proper taxes

#84

Post by AlexandrB »

malvosenior wrote: post #53
AlexandrB wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Why the notion that gov't should be the provider & arbiter of all? Because the government is democratically elected. Billionaires are not. > Why do none of the "they don't pay enough taxes" crowd not realize the rich do so much of, and more efficiently, what the gov't purports to with massive overhead? [citation needed] In fact, there's an easy counter-example. Healthcare. More expensive than any public system, wit…

I trust politicians as much as I trust billionaires: not at all. In fact as the OP points out at least the occasional billionaire will do something productive for society. The same can't be said for the government. > [citation needed] In fact, there's an easy counter-example. Healthcare. More expensive than any public system, with worse outcomes for the general population. The only reason health care is so expensive…

> The same can't be said for the government.

Good point! We all know how ARPANET turned out.

Re: Forget philanthropy. The super-rich should be paying proper taxes

#85

Post by geggam »

ajsnigrutin wrote: post #77
geggam wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why is it tired? The wealthy benefit from the social infrastructure they live in. Should they not pay for it ? Think of the wear and tear the roads get from the Amazon delivery service alone.

Doesn't amazon pay road taxes for their trucks (or whatever they're called over there)?

The US road taxes doesnt cover the damage done.

Not to mention the US is huge, the actual cost of fixing the infrastructure would be staggering. It needs fixing too.

Re: Forget philanthropy. The super-rich should be paying proper taxes

#86

Post by geraltofrivia »

bonoboTP wrote: post #2

Scott Alexander had a compelling argument against this: https://slatestarcodex.com/2019/07/29/against-against-billio...

In my opinion, the problem isn't that people hate on Billionaires for philanthropic acts, but increasing wealth gap. In other words - very fact that billionaires exist.

Re: Forget philanthropy. The super-rich should be paying proper taxes

#87

Post by blantonl »

roenxi wrote: post #17

At least everyone can agree that government taxing should be higher than government spending^. This article is mainly baiting rich v poor division; on a close read it doesn't actually say much. The real issue is that everything in general has become so complicated that nobody has a hope of understanding how it works. Unless we have accountants on deck today nobody really has a feel for how much the rich pay in taxes…

The '70%' regime was then reinvesting all those profits right back into their businesses to avoid those taxes, which spurred job growth and R&D innovation.

The simple reality is that today's "regime" simply stockpiles that wealth for their own benefit and then gives out a few token amounts to charitable causes and thinks that will stave off the pitchforks when the uprising begin.

Giving money to charity doesn't cleanse your soul of it's moral responsibility to society. As abrasive as it sounds, it may very well be true that if someone is in the position to be giving out millions to charitable foundations that end up making a lot of people fat from managing them, maybe they took too much in the first place.

Re: Forget philanthropy. The super-rich should be paying proper taxes

#88

Post by jandrewrogers »

AlexandrB wrote: post #26
ctdonath wrote: post #7

Why the notion that gov't should be the provider & arbiter of all? Why do none of the "they don't pay enough taxes" crowd not realize the rich do so much of, and more efficiently, what the gov't purports to with massive overhead? Job creation, charity, arts funding, lowering costs of necessities, etc - and at levels & locations which gov't would never achieve. The "tax/soak the rich" notion seems almost entirely puni…

> Why the notion that gov't should be the provider & arbiter of all? Because the government is democratically elected. Billionaires are not. > Why do none of the "they don't pay enough taxes" crowd not realize the rich do so much of, and more efficiently, what the gov't purports to with massive overhead? [citation needed] In fact, there's an easy counter-example. Healthcare. More expensive than any public system, wit…

> More expensive than any public system, with worse outcomes for the general population.

US public schools are also more expensive than any public system, with worse outcomes for the general population. These are operated by the government.

There is little evidence that making a service "public" will make it less expensive to operate, quite the opposite. The underlying cause of relatively expensive US services is not who is operating it, as they are expensive no matter who does.

Re: Forget philanthropy. The super-rich should be paying proper taxes

#89

Post by deckar01 »

Extremely wealthy people don't just donate to charity to cherry-pick the social programs they support. They also gain influence over organizations and communities. They promise support to gain favor and threaten withholding to gain influence. People this rich don't need more money, they want more power.

Re: Forget philanthropy. The super-rich should be paying proper taxes

#90

Post by bogus_323423 »

> we must make them be good

Lash the sinners into virtue, eh?

Good luck with the whole killing satan with his own pitchfork thing. All this does is turn those who try into demons; if you can hurt class enemies for being insufficiently good, you can do the same to anyone. And nobody ever accused the proletariat of being excessively possessed of virtue...

This is just a thin veneer over the libido dominandi. "We can't wait to remake society in the image of the blood god, so sacrifices must be made. No, not my kids ha ha"

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