NBA's China dilemma: $4B at risk as Chinese TV cancels game broadcasts • Hacker News Board

Re: NBA's China dilemma: $4B at risk as Chinese TV cancels game broadcasts

#391

Post by behringer » Wed, Oct 09, 2019, 3:37 AM UTC

filoleg wrote: post #286

justaduderr wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't have too much time to educate you on these things but just to note: Re: "60 to 100 million of its citizens" is just straight up wrong. There was a Great Famine in China* - Mao did not murder up to 100 million citizens. Are you serious? Your own source says as much. Re: Social Credit System (SCS) - By pretty much every metric the SCS has not resulted in massive discrimination on the scale of racism and sexism…

>the American education system is an embarrassment. Must be why all the elites from China send their kids to get college education in the US.

They do that to teach them English culture and the language, since china is an export economy. They already had a proper education in China before they ever show up. Unless they're at an elite school, the work is relatively easy, so they can focus on language.

Re: NBA's China dilemma: $4B at risk as Chinese TV cancels game broadcasts

#392

Post by lern_too_spel » Wed, Oct 09, 2019, 3:38 AM UTC

CompanionCuuube wrote: post #336

lern_too_spel wrote: post #321

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're talking about being strictly global utilitarian in all actions which is completely unworkable when it endangers the actor. Of course, they aren't as hard on China because of money. I don't see why they need to spell it out so as not to appear dishonest — it's so obvious that it can be assumed. That doesn't mean it is better to also not be hard on North Carolina, which is OP's error. There is no moral framework…

Their actions also go against deontological ethics as well.

Indeed, but not doing anything in both cases is still worse in that system, which is the point. You have to do wild contortions to make doing one fewer good thing better .

Re: NBA's China dilemma: $4B at risk as Chinese TV cancels game broadcasts

#393

Post by hktruth » Wed, Oct 09, 2019, 3:39 AM UTC

tw04 wrote: post #20

The NBA really needs to grow a spine on this one. They have nothing to lose but incremental profits and in the long run China will lose. It will just be one more reminder for the populace that their current government restricts them from luxuries the rest of the world gets to experience. And if that doesn't bother them, good riddance I guess, it's not like China is going to come up with their own basketball league th…

I think focusing on the NBA and China misses the bigger issue that affects everyone.

What if Daryl Morey had tweeted that he believed marriage was between a man and a woman?

There's no doubt he would have been fired and deplatformed faster than greased lightning...

Social media is making it hard for individuals to keep their personal thoughts separate from their work.

Not sure what the answer is. Everybody chill?

Re: NBA's China dilemma: $4B at risk as Chinese TV cancels game broadcasts

#394

Post by unityByFreedom » Wed, Oct 09, 2019, 3:40 AM UTC

xlc0212 wrote: post #332

tomohawk wrote: post #318

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Basketball is popular in China. The NBA is the premier league. It doesn't need China. If you want to see the best or play with the best, it will be the NBA. If the CCP (China Communist Party) wants to spoil the entertainment of the citizenry, that's their problem. The NBA can go right back into China whenever the winds change. On the other hand, if the NBA doesn't stand up to China, a large part of their core audienc…

This is another thing I feel uneasy about, this is just a basketball league, why does it have to force people to pick a side?

Who upped the ante? One guy who tweeted something, or a government who blocked a whole industry? NBA isn't forcing anything. They would continue showing their programming in China if it were not blocked.

Re: NBA's China dilemma: $4B at risk as Chinese TV cancels game broadcasts

#395

Post by CriticalCathed » Wed, Oct 09, 2019, 3:46 AM UTC

ivankolev wrote: post #39

tw04 wrote: post #20

The NBA really needs to grow a spine on this one. They have nothing to lose but incremental profits and in the long run China will lose. It will just be one more reminder for the populace that their current government restricts them from luxuries the rest of the world gets to experience. And if that doesn't bother them, good riddance I guess, it's not like China is going to come up with their own basketball league th…

They are taking a stance: https://www.cnn.com/2019/10/08/media/nba-adam-silver/index.h...

And that stance is "we love money."

That was nothing but PR doubletalk.

Re: NBA's China dilemma: $4B at risk as Chinese TV cancels game broadcasts

#396

Post by whoevercares » Wed, Oct 09, 2019, 3:54 AM UTC

kleer001 wrote: post #238

themgt wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The reality is, our political and corporate elites made a deal with the devil two decades ago, because the $ to be made off-shoring manufacturing and gaining access to Chinese markets was too good to pass up. They lied to the public that China posed no economic or military threat going forward, and that our glorious free markets would inevitably lead to a bottom-up liberalization of China. Instead, we've played ourse…

20 years ago? I'd pin it on Nixon's visit in 1972, nearly 50 years ago. Without that I'd bet China would have civil warred and bootstrapped its self into Democracy.

Every single Chinese Civil war in history is brutal and could cause tens of millions deaths. Let alone with the huge population and peculiar culture it might not necessarily end up in a democracy system. I don’t really think it would be better in that parallel universe

Re: NBA's China dilemma: $4B at risk as Chinese TV cancels game broadcasts

#397

Post by unityByFreedom » Wed, Oct 09, 2019, 3:58 AM UTC

wuliwong wrote: post #258

munificent wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My I'm just feeling cynical, but this just sounds to me like an easy way to have it both ways: 1. Placate the US by putting out a public statement saying "We support freedom of speech for our people." 2. Placate China by using a backchannel to ensure that no one in the NBA actually uses this nominal freedom to say something that hurts China's feelings. Actually standing up would require supporting a statement that ha…

You are just theorizing that #2 is happening with no evidence.

NBA tried to placate China on Weibo here,

> However, a statement posted in Chinese by the NBA on Weibo, China’s Twitter-like microblogging site, appeared different, according to translators.

> “We feel greatly disappointed at Houston Rockets’ GM Daryl Morey’s inappropriate speech, which is regrettable," the statement read. "Without a doubt, he has deeply offended many Chinese basketball fans. Morey has clarified that his stance on this issue does not represent either Houston Rockets or the NBA. From NBA’s perspective, people can be interested in different subjects and freely share their opinions. We take respecting Chinese history and culture as a serious matter. We also hope that sports and the NBA, as a unified source of positive energy, can continue to build bridges between countries and bring people together. "

https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nba/2019/10/07/nba-chi...

Regardless of whether the NBA has control over what is said on that account, it's pretty shitty to have it one way in one country and another way elsewhere while hiding behind a language barrier. If this kind of double-speak continues, they're playing us all for fools.

Re: NBA's China dilemma: $4B at risk as Chinese TV cancels game broadcasts

#398

Post by VladimirIvanov » Wed, Oct 09, 2019, 3:59 AM UTC

repolfx wrote: post #219

SilasX wrote: post #147

Is it just me, or are there a lot of stories now about China throwing its financial weight around to influence speech? We had the Blizzard/War of Omens thing [1], and the Houston Rockets remark being rescinded [2], and the South Park cancellation [3], and now this, all in the span of about a week. [1] https://www.cnet.com/news/blizzard-removes-blitzchung-from-h... [2] https://www.cnbc.com/2019/10/07/houston-rockets-g…

Also the UBS pig incident: https://fortune.com/2019/06/17/ubs-china-pig-paul-donovan/ That one wasn't even anything apparently political, just absurd snowflake-scale sensitivity on the part of a whole country: Donovan made the “Chinese pig” comment on Wednesday as he attempted to explain why the country’s swine flu outbreak shouldn’t concern investors eyeing the international inflation outlook. “Does this matter? It…

I didn't follow this at the time but I can immediately see that there exactly two ways to interpret the "Chinese pig" comment and one is very insulting. I'm guessing that the person who said the quote did not mean it as an insult

Re: NBA's China dilemma: $4B at risk as Chinese TV cancels game broadcasts

#399

Post by petre » Wed, Oct 09, 2019, 4:02 AM UTC

Lukeas14 wrote: post #344

cylinder wrote: post #327

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People need to stop talking about China like it's a single unit and the government can control every single thing its people do. They threatened certain countries and yet tourist and student arrivals from China only increased. If they block NBA Chinese fans will still find a way to consume it.

They'll find a way to consume it. But the NBA will probably make much more money through legitimate products in China than if Chinese fans are watching pirated streams over VPN and buying counterfeit, unlicensed jerseys.

The jerseys are probably made in China anyway. Unlicensed = the NBA doesn't make money from license fees. Maybe wearing an NBA shirt in China would equate to wearing one with Winnie the Pooh?

Re: NBA's China dilemma: $4B at risk as Chinese TV cancels game broadcasts

#400

Post by unityByFreedom » Wed, Oct 09, 2019, 4:03 AM UTC

xdarnold wrote: post #390

ivankolev wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They are taking a stance: https://www.cnn.com/2019/10/08/media/nba-adam-silver/index.h...

This is nothing more than the illusion of a stance so long as the statement on Weibo stands. Publicly calling Morey's statement "inappropriate" and "disappoint[ing]" and expressing regret for it cannot be reconciled with supporting free speech.

Here is the Weibo statement for those who haven't seen it,

> However, a statement posted in Chinese by the NBA on Weibo, China’s Twitter-like microblogging site, appeared different, according to translators.

> “We feel greatly disappointed at Houston Rockets’ GM Daryl Morey’s inappropriate speech, which is regrettable," the statement read. "Without a doubt, he has deeply offended many Chinese basketball fans. Morey has clarified that his stance on this issue does not represent either Houston Rockets or the NBA. From NBA’s perspective, people can be interested in different subjects and freely share their opinions. We take respecting Chinese history and culture as a serious matter. We also hope that sports and the NBA, as a unified source of positive energy, can continue to build bridges between countries and bring people together. "

https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nba/2019/10/07/nba-chi...