Starving cancer by cutting off its favorite foods • Hacker News Board

Re: Starving cancer by cutting off its favorite foods

#81

Post by reggieband » Wed, Oct 09, 2019, 1:47 AM UTC

cco wrote: post #55

lukifer wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Perhaps a good rule of thumb: any time a significant number of worldwide religions independently converge on a single practice/idea, there may be something of value there worth porting to the secular world (see also: the sabbath, and the "golden rule").

If I ever retire and become a cult leader this is my pet religion, I call it Vennism. Combine all the teachings and trim away those teachings that aren't common, what you're left with seems like it would probably be a good religion right?

Kinda like the Perennial Philosophy [1]

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perennial_philosophy

Re: Starving cancer by cutting off its favorite foods

#82

Post by TimSchumann » Wed, Oct 09, 2019, 1:47 AM UTC

norswap wrote: post #59

omarchowdhury wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You went 60 days without eating?

I think it was a typo and he meant 60 days without carbohydrates.

No, 60 days, first 30 water/salt only, second 30 I added in a few supplements, nothing that could really count as calorie intake though.

I also adhered to a strict no coffee/tea policy.

Re: Starving cancer by cutting off its favorite foods

#83

Post by ereyes01 » Wed, Oct 09, 2019, 1:47 AM UTC

rorykoehler wrote: post #74

TimSchumann wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The amount of carbohydrates you need in your diet to survive is exactly zero. They’re a non-essential macronutrient. The amount of glucose you need in your blood stream to keep everything running smoothly is a very small amount easily produced by your body through a process called gluconeogenesis. I went 60 days sans any calories and my body self regulated glucose just fine.

What was fasting for 60 days like? Any negative experiences?

Does hunger count as a negative experience?

Re: Starving cancer by cutting off its favorite foods

#84

Post by GiorgioG » Wed, Oct 09, 2019, 1:53 AM UTC

TimSchumann wrote: post #43

dev_dull wrote: post #6

> your body closely regulates the level of glucose in your blood. Your brain would literally starve without it. Is this actually true? Having done the ketogenic diet and bringing carbohydrates down to almost nothing, my brain definitely didn't starve. In fact, running on ketones was amazing.

The amount of carbohydrates you need in your diet to survive is exactly zero. They’re a non-essential macronutrient. The amount of glucose you need in your blood stream to keep everything running smoothly is a very small amount easily produced by your body through a process called gluconeogenesis. I went 60 days sans any calories and my body self regulated glucose just fine.

I went 21 days with just water and electrolytes. My son is a type 1 diabetic so I had access to a glucose meter to test myself with. My blood glucose level at about the halfway mark was 59mg/dL (for reference, most non-diabetics should be between 70-130.)

I won't say fasting for 21 days was the most pleasant experience, but it is entirely doable by the average healthy person. Nice job going 60 days. The hardest part for me was the social aspect, family/friends' repeated concerns because I'm 'starving myself', sitting at the dinner table while everyone else eats, etc.

Re: Starving cancer by cutting off its favorite foods

#85

Post by TimSchumann » Wed, Oct 09, 2019, 1:54 AM UTC

rorykoehler wrote: post #74

TimSchumann wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The amount of carbohydrates you need in your diet to survive is exactly zero. They’re a non-essential macronutrient. The amount of glucose you need in your blood stream to keep everything running smoothly is a very small amount easily produced by your body through a process called gluconeogenesis. I went 60 days sans any calories and my body self regulated glucose just fine.

What was fasting for 60 days like? Any negative experiences?

One negative experience, slight hair loss that started approximately 6 to 8 weeks post fast. Maybe 10 to 15% of the hair on my head fell out in total, but it all grew back.

One other negative experience but that was due to my own stupidity and I've since learned better.

Basically if you're above 15% bodyfat, you only need two things to live. Water and electrolytes.

If anyone has any questions, more than happy to answer e-mails.

Re: Starving cancer by cutting off its favorite foods

#86

Post by DoreenMichele » Wed, Oct 09, 2019, 1:58 AM UTC

jacobolus wrote: post #78

DoreenMichele wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

About 75-80% of the immune cells in your body can be found in the gut. I suspect that one thing fasting does is frees up those cells to do other stuff.

Are there any studies of the impact of fasting on chronic viral infections, etc.?

I have no idea.

Anecdotally, I've seen people comment on HN and Reddit that fasting helped them with some chronic health issue or other. Here's an HN comment that says he was on antibiotics constantly until he tried fasting:

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20279338

If you find any such studies, please share. Thanks.

Re: Starving cancer by cutting off its favorite foods

#87

Post by bahrd » Wed, Oct 09, 2019, 2:01 AM UTC

pcarolan wrote: post #66

The article is about what cancer eats, not what you eat. The world’s leading neuro-oncologists I’ve talked to don’t believe diet matters.

Yep, bodies filled with glucose unless you're starving to death. Eat fat; glycogenolysis turns it into glucose for your cells; eat protein, the amino acids are used in gluconeogenesis to synthesize glucose. Pretty crucial for cellular respiration.

Re: Starving cancer by cutting off its favorite foods

#88

Post by drwasho » Wed, Oct 09, 2019, 2:05 AM UTC

entee wrote: post #68

Cancer favoring glucose has been known for a very long time, this is called the Warburg Effect: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warburg_effect_(oncology) Interesting new pharmacology for sure, but the end of the article is critical here: "Additionally, an accompanying commentary by William Katt and colleagues indicated that there are no FDA-approved drugs that target glucose and glutamine metabolism. This is because pr…

I worked on this for multiple myeloma. DCA is nice but the concentrations you need for treating people gives them peripheral neuropathy, which isn’t trivial. But fwiw combining DCA with other drugs looks promising.

The issue is that cancer is polyclonal so there is a sub-population that predominantly relies of aerobic glycolysis, but the sub-populations that mostly metabolise glutamine or fatty acids will escape treatment... so you need a bit of a shotgun approach, in combination with traditional anti-cancer agents.

Re: Starving cancer by cutting off its favorite foods

#89

Post by bahrd » Wed, Oct 09, 2019, 2:08 AM UTC

cco wrote: post #55

lukifer wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Perhaps a good rule of thumb: any time a significant number of worldwide religions independently converge on a single practice/idea, there may be something of value there worth porting to the secular world (see also: the sabbath, and the "golden rule").

If I ever retire and become a cult leader this is my pet religion, I call it Vennism. Combine all the teachings and trim away those teachings that aren't common, what you're left with seems like it would probably be a good religion right?

Sounds good, but no kool-aid. We gotta mix all the other religious drinks instead. Thinking like a trippy sangria. You got the Christian wine, some Shamanic ayahuasca, Buddhist tea, Muslim qahwa, maybe a little blood of the innocent for the Satanists out there.

Re: Starving cancer by cutting off its favorite foods

#90

Post by wolco » Wed, Oct 09, 2019, 2:16 AM UTC

TimSchumann wrote: post #85

rorykoehler wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What was fasting for 60 days like? Any negative experiences?

One negative experience, slight hair loss that started approximately 6 to 8 weeks post fast. Maybe 10 to 15% of the hair on my head fell out in total, but it all grew back. One other negative experience but that was due to my own stupidity and I've since learned better. Basically if you're above 15% bodyfat, you only need two things to live. Water and electrolytes. If anyone has any questions, more than happy to answ…

What was the other thing?