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Study: College Students Not Learning Much

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Re: Study: College Students Not Learning Much

#31

Post by psyklic »

mkross wrote: post #10
guywithabike wrote: post #2

Maybe the problem is not the college, but the slacker kids who skim by with the bare minimum effort. I'm always amused when the kids who used to tease me for taking college seriously post Facebook statuses like, "omg y cant i get a job?!?!"

"Them darn kids aint learnin cuz they aint tryin!" Let's consider the assumption that between 36% and 45% of all undergrad students are slackers. Sure, a bunch of students aren't learning because they are slackers, but why there are SO MANY of them? Are there more slackers as a percentage of the population than in the past? Is the internet/cell-phone/facebook era changing the mentality of students to be more focused…

I'd guess slacking is mainly a culture thing. If your friends accept that it's okay, then you'll accept it's okay too.

Re: Study: College Students Not Learning Much

#32

Post by davidu »

kenjackson wrote: post #5

One problem is there is no incentive on the part of the college to teach much. I've long advocated that we need output measures for colleges. Colleges are rated on their input measures -- how competitive is it to get into the school. But no measure of how effective they are at teaching. As of today no one can really say where (on average) you'll learn more/better -- at Harvard or Ohio State. All we know is that Harva…

Colleges help you get out of them what you put into them.

Harvard has more smart students and professors, so you can get more out of them. But any college will provide a sufficient environment for you to learn, study and think critically, if you so choose.

But they won't make you do these things. You are an adult, after all.

Re: Study: College Students Not Learning Much

#33

Post by davidu »

reader5000 wrote: post #7
kenjackson wrote: post #5

One problem is there is no incentive on the part of the college to teach much. I've long advocated that we need output measures for colleges. Colleges are rated on their input measures -- how competitive is it to get into the school. But no measure of how effective they are at teaching. As of today no one can really say where (on average) you'll learn more/better -- at Harvard or Ohio State. All we know is that Harva…

I think 80% of modern college value-added is signalling. Employers should really just accept SAT scores directly, although I'm not sure if that's legal. It would certainly be cheaper.

It's legal.

Re: Study: College Students Not Learning Much

#34

Post by Legion »

For some people, college is truly a joke of an academic experience.

I worked a couple of on-campus jobs at the school I attended. One of those jobs was in the department of Recreation Administration. I couldn't believe it was a major that people paid money to go to school and study. I couldn't believe the tests I photocopied were real - I could easily pass them, and what I didn't know was obviously information easily obtained from a minimal amount of reading of the textbooks.

It was comical, really, although the parents paying the same tuition for that that my parents paid for my CompSci education shouldn't find it funny. It seems to me like there are an increasing number of "paths of low resistance" through college.

Re: Study: College Students Not Learning Much

#35

Post by gxs »

davidu wrote: post #32
kenjackson wrote: post #5

One problem is there is no incentive on the part of the college to teach much. I've long advocated that we need output measures for colleges. Colleges are rated on their input measures -- how competitive is it to get into the school. But no measure of how effective they are at teaching. As of today no one can really say where (on average) you'll learn more/better -- at Harvard or Ohio State. All we know is that Harva…

Colleges help you get out of them what you put into them. Harvard has more smart students and professors, so you can get more out of them. But any college will provide a sufficient environment for you to learn, study and think critically, if you so choose. But they won't make you do these things. You are an adult, after all.

>Colleges help you get out of them what you put into them.

This is the most important point in this entire discussion. I had a pages long post about the wonderful years I spent at Cal, and the not so wonderful ones. But I think in the end, this comment sums it up much better.

Re: Study: College Students Not Learning Much

#36

Post by [deleted] »

idm wrote: post #26
adambourg wrote: post #19

These people are idiots. 2300 college students interviewed... Think about that for 1 minute. That's a sample of less then 10% the size of my university. There are hundreds or even thousands of schools with over 10,000 students. Where has this sample been taken? What colleges? How diverse was the population? Socio-economic statuses? These are all big concerns I have with this statistic. Also, what are they measuring?…

> These people are idiots. 2300 college students interviewed... Think about that for 1 minute. Common sense is no substitute for an intro stats class. 2300 is plenty.

[deleted]

Re: Study: College Students Not Learning Much

#37

Post by jakeg »

Well since critical thinking and "complex reasoning" are impossible to measure on a standardized test, the entire article is pretty much pointless. I.E. the media needs to stop acting like the important effects of education can be measured easily and en masse and therefore reported on in their articles.
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