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Apple Hides Taiwan Flag in Hong Kong

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Re: Apple Hides Taiwan Flag in Hong Kong

#61

Post by blotter_paper »

thrwn_frthr_awy wrote: post #32
degenerate wrote: post #6

The degree that China goes to censor things reminds me of kindergarten. Pull the shades down, and kids won't want to go outside? Is it simply a reminder to their people of who's in charge, at this level of pettiness?

China is showing the ability to control one of the world's largest, and most advanced companies. It isn't petty–it is scary. The U.S. and others have sold their soul to the devil for $299 flat screen tvs.

As if the US hadn't sold their soul already? :/ I'm not trying to downplay the horrors of China, but let's not act like the US had clean hands before importing bulk electronics.

Re: Apple Hides Taiwan Flag in Hong Kong

#62

Post by mistermann »

thrwn_frthr_awy wrote: post #32
degenerate wrote: post #6

The degree that China goes to censor things reminds me of kindergarten. Pull the shades down, and kids won't want to go outside? Is it simply a reminder to their people of who's in charge, at this level of pettiness?

China is showing the ability to control one of the world's largest, and most advanced companies. It isn't petty–it is scary. The U.S. and others have sold their soul to the devil for $299 flat screen tvs.

I would think it also has non-trivial psychological effects on the Chinese public in terms of feelings of national pride, optimism for the future, and allegiance to their communist government. From where I sit, China is executing largely flawlessly, for the maximization of their outcome that is, not the entire world's. But it's the West who made this possible, so I don't place much blame on China.

Re: Apple Hides Taiwan Flag in Hong Kong

#63

Post by president »

awayfromhomenow wrote: post #54
duxup wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it is petty. At the same time it's a good gauge for them to figure out what else they can do. Start with "hey man don't show that one pic" and the company figures "it's one pic, whatever we're not really compromising our values". A few more steps and then it seems less dramatic when it comes to "give us that information on that one user"... and so on. Personally I would expect an external social credit score…

Pretty scary thought, but progress being what it is, I don't see anything blocking it. I'm sure they already decline to do business with anyone that is vocally critical of China, or for example, highly complementary of the Dali Lama.

Happened just yesterday after GM of the Houston Rockets spoke out *for the HK protests: https://www.cnn.com/2019/10/07/business/houston-rockets-nba-...

EDIT: s/against/for/

Re: Apple Hides Taiwan Flag in Hong Kong

#64

Post by vkou »

degenerate wrote: post #6

The degree that China goes to censor things reminds me of kindergarten. Pull the shades down, and kids won't want to go outside? Is it simply a reminder to their people of who's in charge, at this level of pettiness?

This level of pettiness is very much the international norm for territorial and sovereignty disputes.

The only newsworthy thing is that China's a big enough market that it can compel vendors to comply.

Re: Apple Hides Taiwan Flag in Hong Kong

#65

Post by chronic71819 »

yters wrote: post #51
beisner wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a simplistic view. When push comes to shove, companies don't behave with political principles. Apple is not going to throw away access to 1/6 of world's population over a political dispute. It's unrealistic to expect any company to, if they're sufficiently large. The only way to achieve political goals is to apply political pressure directly at the state level, or to work with domestic movements that seek to…

"What does it benefit to gain the whole world if you lose your soul?" - Jesus

> "What does it benefit to gain the whole world if you lose your soul?" - Jesus

I'd gladly sell my soul for a couple of billion. Hell, I'd let it go for a discount at a few tens of millions.

Re: Apple Hides Taiwan Flag in Hong Kong

#66

Post by Analemma_ »

oconnor663 wrote: post #36
degenerate wrote: post #6

The degree that China goes to censor things reminds me of kindergarten. Pull the shades down, and kids won't want to go outside? Is it simply a reminder to their people of who's in charge, at this level of pettiness?

Imagine that the war of 1812 had resulted a complete British/Canadian conquest of the US, which lasted for the most of the 19th century. Then imagine that Florida had successfully seceded from the US after WWII and joined the Soviet Union, along with all of Canada. Then finally imagine that the Soviet Union won the Cold War and has been the sole world superpower for the last thirty years. How would we feel, in that w…

Tell your bosses at the Ministry of Culture that trying to use Britain and the United States as analogies to the situation with Taiwan is going to backfire on you. At this point, Taiwan is fully-independent with its own national identity, and so saying they need to reunify with China is as ridiculous as asking Americans to "reunify" with the UK. It's not gonna happen, at least not voluntarily.

Re: Apple Hides Taiwan Flag in Hong Kong

#67

Post by fauigerzigerk »

duxup wrote: post #19
degenerate wrote: post #6

The degree that China goes to censor things reminds me of kindergarten. Pull the shades down, and kids won't want to go outside? Is it simply a reminder to their people of who's in charge, at this level of pettiness?

I think it is petty. At the same time it's a good gauge for them to figure out what else they can do. Start with "hey man don't show that one pic" and the company figures "it's one pic, whatever we're not really compromising our values". A few more steps and then it seems less dramatic when it comes to "give us that information on that one user"... and so on. Personally I would expect an external social credit score…

>A few more steps and then it seems less dramatic when it comes to "give us that information on that one user"... and so on.

That has already happened. Only instead of handing over data on specific users upon request, Apple has simply handed over all iCloud data of all its (mainland) Chinese users to a government owned company:

https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT208351

Re: Apple Hides Taiwan Flag in Hong Kong

#68

Post by est31 »

ApolloFortyNine wrote: post #48
beisner wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a simplistic view. When push comes to shove, companies don't behave with political principles. Apple is not going to throw away access to 1/6 of world's population over a political dispute. It's unrealistic to expect any company to, if they're sufficiently large. The only way to achieve political goals is to apply political pressure directly at the state level, or to work with domestic movements that seek to…

Google did. Yea they want to head back (now that they realize nobody cared), but they pulled out of China entirely back in 2011 over censorship.

They were also hacked by the Chinese. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Aurora
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