Previous discussion: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21176976
Thanks. I couldn't read the WSJ article (paywall) so submitted the reuters article here.
Houston Rockets general manager apologises for Hong Kong protest tweet
11–20 of 80 posts
Re: Houston Rockets general manager apologises for Hong Kong protest tweet
#12Could you imagine the NBA making players apologize for posting Tweets criticizing Trump? Remember when LeBron and others wore "I Can't Breathe" t-shirts and Adam Silver supported them? Teams & players should be taking a strong stand here to support one of their own, but this really shows that there is a $$$ value for everything, including freedom of speech and expression. Economic threats from a foreign government sh…
Could you imagine the NBA making players apologize for posting Tweets criticizing Trump?
If Trump started an anti-NBA campaign that directly affected their future profits, they would absolutely apologize. See the NFL.
Re: Houston Rockets general manager apologises for Hong Kong protest tweet
#13Wait, a person expressed views in favour of democracy and felt he had to backtrack because of pressure from a dictatorship? Here's how this works: we express views that anger dictatorships, and if there is even a minute chance that your business tanks because of it - then you were in the wrong market or had the wrong owners. The right thing to do here for the NBA would be to stand behind this tweet. Corporations need…
had to backtrack because of pressure from a dictatorship? It's not pressure from a dictatorship that's making them back down, it's pressure from a big potential customer. The dictatorship part is both incidental and irrelevant to the NBA.
It is not at all irrelevant. In a fair economy (one that American companies mostly operate in), Chinese businesses, citizens and broadcasters would judge the Tweet and come to conclusions on their own. The Chinese reaction is instead forced by an authoritarian regime and has no economic merit.
Re: Houston Rockets general manager apologises for Hong Kong protest tweet
#14Could you imagine the NBA making players apologize for posting Tweets criticizing Trump? Remember when LeBron and others wore "I Can't Breathe" t-shirts and Adam Silver supported them? Teams & players should be taking a strong stand here to support one of their own, but this really shows that there is a $$$ value for everything, including freedom of speech and expression. Economic threats from a foreign government sh…
> Could you imagine the NBA making players apologize for posting Tweets criticizing Trump?
You tell me. Didn't the NFL just drag a couple of their players through the mud for having the audacity to kneel in solidarity with victims of racism?
My take on it is that not making authoritarians feel uncomfortable - via exposing them to non-conformity during an anthem - is very important to the NFL. The only expression of politics it permits is a pro-government, unquestionably patriotic one. Which is pretty normal for a sports league.
Re: Houston Rockets general manager apologises for Hong Kong protest tweet
#15If a guy who has earned a GM's salary for years can't stick by his guns regarding free speech before the dollar then maybe nobody can.
Re: Houston Rockets general manager apologises for Hong Kong protest tweet
#16Wait, a person expressed views in favour of democracy and felt he had to backtrack because of pressure from a dictatorship? Here's how this works: we express views that anger dictatorships, and if there is even a minute chance that your business tanks because of it - then you were in the wrong market or had the wrong owners. The right thing to do here for the NBA would be to stand behind this tweet. Corporations need…
Sports are businesses. Businesses, as everyone reminds each other constantly on here, are kind of obliged to seek money first and morality second. Unfortunate, but endemic to the system.
In the case of football, that means taking money from dictatorships to host the World Cup in unbearably hot countries in stadia built by slave labour. Why should basketball be any different?
It's not as if American sport has covered itself in glory in its response to athletes making the smallest, most respectful domestic protest possible about police violence.
Re: Houston Rockets general manager apologises for Hong Kong protest tweet
#17> "Fight for freedom, stand with Hong Kong" -> "I was merely voicing one thought, based on one interpretation, of one complicated event," he said, adding that he had since heard and considered other perspectives. Unless I hear those "other perspectives", I'll simply assume he was exposed to pressure, not reason.
Exposed to the perspectives of how much money he personally stood to gain/lose on the outcome of the NBA's deals with China.
Re: Houston Rockets general manager apologises for Hong Kong protest tweet
#18Wait, a person expressed views in favour of democracy and felt he had to backtrack because of pressure from a dictatorship? Here's how this works: we express views that anger dictatorships, and if there is even a minute chance that your business tanks because of it - then you were in the wrong market or had the wrong owners. The right thing to do here for the NBA would be to stand behind this tweet. Corporations need…
Sports are businesses. Businesses, as everyone reminds each other constantly on here, are kind of obliged to seek money first and morality second. Unfortunate, but endemic to the system. In the case of football, that means taking money from dictatorships to host the World Cup in unbearably hot countries in stadia built by slave labour. Why should basketball be any different? It's not as if American sport has covered…
> host the World Cup
Isn’t that put on by the ostensibly non-profit FIFA? It seems closer to the Olympic Games to this very casual observer.
Re: Houston Rockets general manager apologises for Hong Kong protest tweet
#19Wait, a person expressed views in favour of democracy and felt he had to backtrack because of pressure from a dictatorship? Here's how this works: we express views that anger dictatorships, and if there is even a minute chance that your business tanks because of it - then you were in the wrong market or had the wrong owners. The right thing to do here for the NBA would be to stand behind this tweet. Corporations need…
https://money.cnn.com/2018/02/07/technology/mercedes-benz-ti...
As Sebastian Haffner said, by raising the Jewish question, and many other questions like it, constantly coming up with new ones, the Nazis skillfully managed to evade the Nazi question -- namely, whether they should exist.
Megacorps need us more than we need them, spectator sports certainly needs us more than we need it. And you can't be friends with everybody, either you insult the murderers and their fans by calling it murder, or you insult the victims and yourself by failing to do so. It's not a game where you can join all factions by picking the right dialog options or having enough money.
https://www.facebook.com/joe.tsai.3781/posts/265337893139152...
> 1.4 billion Chinese citizens stand united when it comes to the territorial integrity of China and the country’s sovereignty over her homeland. This issue is non-negotiable.
First off, that's like saying all Germans supported the Nazis because the ones who didn't were dead or didn't dare to speak up. Secondly, it was about always about 5 demands, not secession, and those demands being met with violence, for months.
He doesn't want to be treated remotely like he, by looking away, is implicitly advocating for others to be treated, he simply preaches water and drinks wine, preaches torture camps and police terror and breathes fresh air.
> In 1937, Japan invaded China by capturing Beijing, Shanghai and the then-Chinese capital Nanjing. Imperial Japanese troops committed mass murder and rape against the residents of Nanjing, resulting in several hundred thousand civilian deaths.
Anyone who condemns that, but doesn't condemn what the CCP does, has simply no case, no standing, is the last person who should bring it up. You cannot pick and chose when you apply principles, if you actually have them. A just as valid way too look at it would be totalitarian murderers attacking innocent people. Yes, in that case they were Japanese, but if you support totalitarian murderers, that similarity outweighs what is written in the passport.
Last but not least, if someone in America said "black people are just as decent human beings as white people", and the KKK went apeshit and demanded a retraction, would you care how many members they have, or that they have guns? Or that they are so angry, so badly educated, that they can't be reasoned with? That's what you're going to throw away the few noble things humanity achieved in the last few centuries for? Not in my name, and not with my support.
Re: Houston Rockets general manager apologises for Hong Kong protest tweet
#20Wait, a person expressed views in favour of democracy and felt he had to backtrack because of pressure from a dictatorship? Here's how this works: we express views that anger dictatorships, and if there is even a minute chance that your business tanks because of it - then you were in the wrong market or had the wrong owners. The right thing to do here for the NBA would be to stand behind this tweet. Corporations need…
The problem isn't with angering dictatorships, it's about angering a lot of ordinary Chinese mainlanders who have been convinced that the HK protesters are traitors.
This is a serious problem, because it's simply not possible to persuade them otherwise, because the channels to do so are censored by the Chinese government. It's a crazily scary issue. My family is half Chinese and my niece came over from China this summer. The only things she knew about the HK protests was that some violent anti-mainlander anarchists had protested against the use of the Chinese flag on some buildings. The vast majority of mainlanders have never even heard of the extradition law.
As a result mainland Chinese see any support for the HK protesters as being a direct attack against the identity, nationality and integrity of China and Chinese people. Foreigners being seen as interfering is seen as further proof that the HK protests are incited by foreigners and are an anti-Chinese plot so unless it's handled very carefully it can make the situation worse, not better.
It's tough, but I think the best approach, if you do want to express support for HK, is instead to focus on the Censorship of the issues by the Chinese government.