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The Groupon dirty secret

blackysky.com

11–20 of 23 posts

Re: The Groupon dirty secret

#11
"He should use Groupon once to make more money. He should not use it more than once because it will devalue his service. Also Groupon takes a huge part of the business"

There is a thing called customer acquisition. Yes some people are looking for deals. But even if you get 5% of people who used Groupon to come back again you got your self a constant source of revenue.

Companies kill for those type of clients.

That's why you have contracts for services and companies throw massive $$$ just to acquire you as a locked in customer.

So unless your charts keep track of all the customers Groupon sends to you and tracks their purchases at your store/whatever for a whole year, you can put those charts in a bathroom just in case toilet paper runs out.

They are useless.

Re: The Groupon dirty secret

#12
post #2

I take issue with the graph coloring. "Bad" should have the same color in both graphs and should be on the same side of the graph on both. He uses red for bad in graph1 and blue in graph2. 60% of businesses who try groupon like it enough and may use it again? That's great for client acquisition for most types of businesses. 67% of businesses who ran a promotion made a profit during that promotion? That's great . Lots…

If Groupon makes money by taking it away from advertisers, these numbers are compelling. Just consider John Wanamakers famous line: "Half the money I spend on advertising is wasted; the trouble is I don't know which half."

The fact that this quip still has plenty of currency a century later indicates just how exposed the advertising business really is.

Re: The Groupon dirty secret

#13
I recently stated that I would very much like to short Facebook.

I would like to add that I would also like to short Groupon.

I'll let you guys draw out the parallels, I have some roti canai to nibble on.

Re: The Groupon dirty secret

#14
How trustworthy is the feedback from these dissatisfied businesses?

People have a strong tendency to blame others for their problems and this case is no different. Groupon and its "disloyal" customers are an easy scapegoat for the business' own problems.

Groupon just brings customers in, they don't magically make the business better.

When analyzing the effectiveness of Groupon we should be most concerned with how well businesses with a good product or service did using Groupon.

Re: The Groupon dirty secret

#15
post #3

The Groupon CEO is saying that businesses have a chance to make more bulk sales. I can't see what's wrong with that. Distributors will normally set a hefty markup to cover the costs of goods not moving. If you have a semi-guarantee that they would move, that markup can be lowered.

Agreed, and isn't that the whole point of group buying in the first place? Groupon didn't invent the group buying model, they're just enabling / automating it. I see nothing wrong with that. If a business can't benefit enough from the higher volume guaranteed buys to cover the fees, then they probably shouldn't expect miracles from any group buying service.

Using it purely for advertising / marketing seems secondary and questionable to me.

Re: The Groupon dirty secret

#16
Groupon's real "dirty secret" is that they've brilliantly navigated the seedy world of affiliate marketing. As far as I know, Groupon uses the same affiliate networks as Acai scam artists (as opposed to say, building their own a la Amazon) and is (was?) willing to pay several dollars for a single email address.

How they managed that is the real secret and I would be extremely interested in that story.

Re: The Groupon dirty secret

#17
[Groupon Employee Speaking]

Keep in mind that when that study was done (June 2009), Groupon was 9 months old. Since then, Groupon has expanded to dozens of countries and hundreds of cities, raised over $1B, hired thousands of employees, and refined its processes a zillion-fold.

It's no secret in the company that our long term success is based on a) customers having great experiences, and b) merchants getting a return on the cost of their discount and fees to us. Everything is viewed through those two values. Deals are scheduled so that customers are always delighted (e.g. so there aren't 4 steakhouses in one week), and sized so that merchants don't get raped by the economics (e.g. if a typical bill at a restaurant is $100, then the deal might be $60 for $30. Also, quantity is estimated based on the merchant's capacity as well so that merchants don't get overwhelmed and customers still get a good experience. In the video for the recent Japanese new year debacle (http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2111609), Andrew mentions that deal sizing and scaling is already done in some markets and in response to the Japan incident, will now be done in all markets to ensure the experience continues to be good for everyone. Short-term profit maximization isn't what builds lasting businesses, and the execs here know it.

With something growing as ridiculously fast as Groupon, data get stale fast. It's like if you found a study from 2006 where someone complained that they couldn't find anyone they knew on Facebook.

It's always wise to take a company's numbers with a grain of sale, but with a fast growing company, the numbers they selectively release are usually the best you're going to get.

Re: The Groupon dirty secret

#18
As Groupon Employee pchristensen has pointed out in this thread, Groupon has hired thousands of employees. According to the Wall Street Journal, "about half" of them are in sales (I suspect it's more). The real measure of Groupon (which I haven't seen yet, and it is probably because it's too early to measure) is going to be small business retention rate. Groupon is very much in the same space as web Yellow Page/directory companies, but with a much more profitable business model. It is likewise vulnerable to the problem of churn. Those thousands of telemarketers can burn through all the local businesses fairly quickly. How many will stick around 2 years from now?

http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1968491

Re: The Groupon dirty secret

#19
I think Groupon has one small problem, and that's when they sell a holiday in Wales in an offer in, say, Sheffield. So the business isn't actually in the city it's selling into.

Also, Groupon offering deals in towns (not just cities) would be great for us non-city dwellers.

But it sounds like an honest business, and I hope I find a deal I like.

Re: The Groupon dirty secret

#20
post #12
post #2

I take issue with the graph coloring. "Bad" should have the same color in both graphs and should be on the same side of the graph on both. He uses red for bad in graph1 and blue in graph2. 60% of businesses who try groupon like it enough and may use it again? That's great for client acquisition for most types of businesses. 67% of businesses who ran a promotion made a profit during that promotion? That's great . Lots…

If Groupon makes money by taking it away from advertisers, these numbers are compelling. Just consider John Wanamakers famous line: "Half the money I spend on advertising is wasted; the trouble is I don't know which half." The fact that this quip still has plenty of currency a century later indicates just how exposed the advertising business really is.

Correction: When I specified whose lunch Groupon was eating, I said 'advertisers'. I should have said 'advertising agencies'.

From an advertiser's perspective, Groupon's pitch is really compelling. Instead of spending money on traditional media-buys to generate some interest and a few sales, spend the same money generating a lot of actual sales, and call it a day.

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