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Hong Kong protests: Authorities to announce face mask ban

bbc.co.uk

21–30 of 134 posts

Re: Hong Kong protests: Authorities to announce face mask ban

#21
post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Please don't compare the Chinese government's actions to the Trump administration. They're not even remotely close.

[flagged]

Trump is not entitled to any such assumption, you cannot assume the moral character of an individual based on their national origin.

Re: Hong Kong protests: Authorities to announce face mask ban

#22
post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

I'm sorry, did you just seriously say, "The Chinese are not fundamentally good human beings"? Because I'm trying to read your comment as anything other than unbelievably racist and coming up empty.

[flagged]

Re: Hong Kong protests: Authorities to announce face mask ban

#23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Trump is not entitled to any such assumption, you cannot assume the moral character of an individual based on their national origin.

I'm not. This has nothing to do with national origin. I explicitly said the presumption is based on having been raised in a democracy and therefore having been exposed to enlightened views.

Re: Hong Kong protests: Authorities to announce face mask ban

#24
post #3

It really feels like democracy is slowly dying all over the world.

> It really feels like democracy is slowly dying all over the world. If it seems that way, it's because we've stopped fighting for it. Any regime without some basic level of true democratic representation and civil liberties should be the subject of official embargoes and individual boycotts. Unfortunately, many have sold out democracy to please the all-important shareholders or just to take advantage of cheap stuff.

The supremely naive "end of history"-era thinking has a lot of inertia. Now it's unclear who's left to fight for Democracy as the old champions are all dead and current generations have no concept of what that would even mean since they've just been reaping the rewards their whole lives.

Re: Hong Kong protests: Authorities to announce face mask ban

#25
During the American revolutionary war, France was a tremendous ally and instrumental to the colonies’ secession from Britain. The Marquis de Lafayette came over to fight for us, without pay, in his early 20s, forgoing his family’s desires and aristocratic opportunities. His family was so opposed to him going to the colonies, that local governments were involved in finding and preventing him from boarding ships. He eventually made his way over here, and fought for glory and because of his own sense of morality.

Recently, I’ve been thinking about the HK scenario and wondering what I can do, but I can’t shake a nagging feeling that I could simply go over there and fight alongside the protestors. I often deflect with observations like “I don’t speak the language,” or “I don’t know what I would do to help,” and yet the thought keeps coming back.

I wonder whether Lafayette would have done the same if he were alive in our time. I think the answer is he would, and that I am more of a coward than I want to believe.

Re: Hong Kong protests: Authorities to announce face mask ban

#26

Will this have any practical effect on the protests? Haven't the authorities already declared that protesters are engaged in illegal activity, so what's one more act of civil disobedience? Also, aren't the "masks" worn by many of the protesters the kind of thing that's often worn in Asia for hygiene and pollution reasons, so this would ban even innocent behavior?

Make everything illegal and selectively enforce against people the state doesn't like is a viable strategy for an authoritarian government.

This might be a problem for the HK government, but I'm not sure rule of law is as big of a selling point to global capital as it used to be.

Re: Hong Kong protests: Authorities to announce face mask ban

#27

During the American revolutionary war, France was a tremendous ally and instrumental to the colonies’ secession from Britain. The Marquis de Lafayette came over to fight for us, without pay, in his early 20s, forgoing his family’s desires and aristocratic opportunities. His family was so opposed to him going to the colonies, that local governments were involved in finding and preventing him from boarding ships. He ev…

Your heart is in the right place but it's absurd to think about "going over there and fight" - we are not living in the 19th century. We should be lobbying our governments (plural intended) for prompt and decisive military action, preferably involving the use of nuclear weapon since China will be sure to use it if we don't use it first. Japan had hoped to quickly disable US Navy by Pearl Harbor, which it nearly accomplished. The same strategy is the one we should be pursuing, only with modern weaponry.

Re: Hong Kong protests: Authorities to announce face mask ban

#28
post #3

It really feels like democracy is slowly dying all over the world.

I wouldn't say that democracy is dying so much as freedom is dying. You can always vote yourself into oppression, but you can only shoot your way out (2nd amendment) if you first fail to talk (1st amendment) the masses out of voting for their own oppression.

> You can always vote yourself into oppression

True. But those in power can suppress voter turnout through a variety of means, whether thats spread of misinformation ("voting is [wrong day] at [wrong location]!"), literal voter suppression (intimidation tactics at places of voting, illegally collecting and destroying mail in ballots), to structural rigging, like gerrymandering.

We're definitely seeing a mixture of both. Democracy is certainly facing a lot of challenges. Many of them have been around for years, but are finally having a light cast on them... while others are newer, more nefarious.

Re: Hong Kong protests: Authorities to announce face mask ban

#29
post #4

I have so much respect for those protesters.

Agreed. They've been educated about history and understand what's at stake. I wish the rest of democratic societies would already be taking a strong stand with them. The tyrannical powers in control of China at the moment, much like Trump's rise, will be countered at the HK situations wakens us to the behaviour of China's tyrants until now relative limited light being shone on their bad behaviours. Edit: Especially c…

Time to burn some karma again.

Google "gent forum spies" sans quotes, look for cryptome(dot)org. Should be an article from july, 2012ish.

Give it a read. It's a bit of an eye opener for the uninitiated.

Re: Hong Kong protests: Authorities to announce face mask ban

#30
post #29
post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agreed. They've been educated about history and understand what's at stake. I wish the rest of democratic societies would already be taking a strong stand with them. The tyrannical powers in control of China at the moment, much like Trump's rise, will be countered at the HK situations wakens us to the behaviour of China's tyrants until now relative limited light being shone on their bad behaviours. Edit: Especially c…

Time to burn some karma again. Google "gent forum spies" sans quotes, look for cryptome(dot)org. Should be an article from july, 2012ish. Give it a read. It's a bit of an eye opener for the uninitiated.

Many thanks @salawat, interesting reading indeed.
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