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France Set to Roll Out Nationwide Facial Recognition ID Program

bloomberg.com

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Re: France Set to Roll Out Nationwide Facial Recognition ID Program

#11

Post by seszett »

pascalmahe wrote: post #10

I don't know much about infosec but I know enough to see that this tool is not ready. It's really scary. Also the fact that it's not discussed much, here in France. It's the first time I've heard of it. From a country that has had a government agency for protecting digital liberties since 1978 (which made laws about what data you can and cannot keep as a software provider) it's a big change of direction.

What is scary about it, though? It's really just adding a new way of authenticating on government websites. I like the idea of how it works, but I don't find it very secure, compared to Belgium's chip and pin system for example (this application is the equivalent to Belgium's itsme, which I use often enough).

However it's probably the best we can do in France since we don't want to have a centralised citizens database.

Re: France Set to Roll Out Nationwide Facial Recognition ID Program

#12

Post by mlthoughts2018 »

mytailorisrich wrote: post #5

This is a rather poor and click-baity article. According to the French government's page on this system [1] (in French): The system is an app that generates login details to allow online access to (public?) services. You install the app on your smartphone. It uses NFC (I suppose) to read your picture (also other details?) from your passport's chip, and stores it locally on the phone. It then uses this to perform faci…

Until there’s a data breach or phone exploit of course. Because it certainly increases the surface area of vulnerability to such attacks.

Re: France Set to Roll Out Nationwide Facial Recognition ID Program

#13

Post by lucb1e »

Ensorceled wrote: post #9
jacquesm wrote: post #4

One day we will regret this computer revolution in ways that we currently can't begin to imagine.

I would say quite a few sci-fi authors have done a good job on this ...

My favorite author in that genre is Daniel Suarez, who makes some scarily accurate thrillers. It's not all 100% realistic, but as someone who is often annoyed at the deus ex machina[1] of other (science) fiction, this is really great. The author is a former software engineer, so I guess they know quite well how technology works in general.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deus_ex_machina

Re: France Set to Roll Out Nationwide Facial Recognition ID Program

#14

Post by aclelland »

moksly wrote: post #6

Android only? I’m sure it’ll get an iOS version too, but what about people who don’t have smartphones? In Denmark we’re seeing more and more public services move to Apps. It used to be that there was an offline version, like in the case of our “NemID”, but now we’re talking about digital only drivers licenses and social security cards. The private sector had long embraced mobile apps, and it’s really hard to buy tick…

The lack of iOS support may be due to the way Apple restricts the use of NFC on iOS devices[1]. This seems to be changing in iOS 13 though.

[1] https://gototags.com/blog/apple-expands-nfc-on-iphone-in-ios...

Re: France Set to Roll Out Nationwide Facial Recognition ID Program

#15

Post by epse »

seszett wrote: post #11
pascalmahe wrote: post #10

I don't know much about infosec but I know enough to see that this tool is not ready. It's really scary. Also the fact that it's not discussed much, here in France. It's the first time I've heard of it. From a country that has had a government agency for protecting digital liberties since 1978 (which made laws about what data you can and cannot keep as a software provider) it's a big change of direction.

What is scary about it, though? It's really just adding a new way of authenticating on government websites. I like the idea of how it works, but I don't find it very secure, compared to Belgium's chip and pin system for example (this application is the equivalent to Belgium's itsme, which I use often enough). However it's probably the best we can do in France since we don't want to have a centralised citizens databas…

itsme has me really scared about it's security, especially since they are so handwavy about it. I browsed their site for a long time before enrolling, but didn't find anything useful.

Re: France Set to Roll Out Nationwide Facial Recognition ID Program

#17

Post by seszett »

epse wrote: post #15
seszett wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What is scary about it, though? It's really just adding a new way of authenticating on government websites. I like the idea of how it works, but I don't find it very secure, compared to Belgium's chip and pin system for example (this application is the equivalent to Belgium's itsme, which I use often enough). However it's probably the best we can do in France since we don't want to have a centralised citizens databas…

itsme has me really scared about it's security, especially since they are so handwavy about it. I browsed their site for a long time before enrolling, but didn't find anything useful.

What were your concerns about it?

Re: France Set to Roll Out Nationwide Facial Recognition ID Program

#18

Post by mytailorisrich »

mlthoughts2018 wrote: post #12
mytailorisrich wrote: post #5

This is a rather poor and click-baity article. According to the French government's page on this system [1] (in French): The system is an app that generates login details to allow online access to (public?) services. You install the app on your smartphone. It uses NFC (I suppose) to read your picture (also other details?) from your passport's chip, and stores it locally on the phone. It then uses this to perform faci…

Until there’s a data breach or phone exploit of course. Because it certainly increases the surface area of vulnerability to such attacks.

In fairness most people already have pictures of themselves on their phones, and ID pictures stored in passports can be read by anyone (who is near enough).

Re: France Set to Roll Out Nationwide Facial Recognition ID Program

#19

Post by jokoon »

mytailorisrich wrote: post #5

This is a rather poor and click-baity article. According to the French government's page on this system [1] (in French): The system is an app that generates login details to allow online access to (public?) services. You install the app on your smartphone. It uses NFC (I suppose) to read your picture (also other details?) from your passport's chip, and stores it locally on the phone. It then uses this to perform faci…

I'm french, I've heard of this biometric thing, and so far it doesn't seem people are really scared of this, so... yeah, it sounds click-baity.

French people are very sensitive to their rights and liberties, and are very quick to organize protests. Many steps were taken to monitor potential terrorists since the Paris attacks, and those were not well received, but politically it was hard to not implement those measures.

I might be a little patriot, but generally the french state does a good job, mainly because french citizens and voters are forcing the government to have pretty high standards.

Re: France Set to Roll Out Nationwide Facial Recognition ID Program

#20

Post by Legogris »

jokoon wrote: post #19
mytailorisrich wrote: post #5

This is a rather poor and click-baity article. According to the French government's page on this system [1] (in French): The system is an app that generates login details to allow online access to (public?) services. You install the app on your smartphone. It uses NFC (I suppose) to read your picture (also other details?) from your passport's chip, and stores it locally on the phone. It then uses this to perform faci…

I'm french, I've heard of this biometric thing, and so far it doesn't seem people are really scared of this, so... yeah, it sounds click-baity. French people are very sensitive to their rights and liberties, and are very quick to organize protests. Many steps were taken to monitor potential terrorists since the Paris attacks, and those were not well received, but politically it was hard to not implement those measure…

Don't you think there would be more outrage if more people were aware both that it's happening and of its implications and possibilities? I think there's a large ignorance (and I can't really blame people) here. The interview subjects in the articles from across the spectrum are all concerned.

It seems there's contention inside the government as well.

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