Samsung ends mobile phone production in China • Hacker News Board

Re: Samsung ends mobile phone production in China

#41

Post by zwayhowder » Thu, Oct 03, 2019, 5:49 AM UTC

hardwaresofton wrote: post #9

latchkey wrote: post #5

Samsung already makes most of their phones in Vietnam. Not a huge difference, other than the lack of tariffs. https://www.economist.com/asia/2018/04/12/why-samsung-of-sou...

I wonder why more producers haven't made this move? If Vietnam is there as far as infrastructure goes and they have the skilled/unskilled labor why is this not a more popular move. Also when we say "make" I assume we mean "assembles". Somewhat anecdotally I recently purchased a laptop and tried to find one that wasn't made in China and it was nigh on impossible.

Go to Japan. A number of Panasonic, Fujitsu & Sony laptops are made there that are only ever sold in the domestic market because of the high costs. Though for the build quality they are still not too bad in terms of value.

Of course their displays and RAM are probably made in Korea or China as are the SSDs and I've never pulled one apart to check the motherboard and battery providence...

However they are definitely assembled in Japan.

Re: Samsung ends mobile phone production in China

#42

Post by thrwweasdfa243 » Thu, Oct 03, 2019, 5:54 AM UTC

Note - Vietnam has an FTA with India (unlike China), and so this also helps it fight back against Chinese smartphone players that are currently dominating in India AND it also works as a bargaining chip with the Indian govt. for tax incentives. IIRC they moved their television assembly back to Vietnam in retaliation for some failed deal last year.

Might be a good idea too, the Indian state is a moronic rent-seeking state whose sole purpose it'd often appear is to run a leaky incompetent "welfare state" simply in order to support of its political masters.

Re: Samsung ends mobile phone production in China

#43

Post by pjmlp » Thu, Oct 03, 2019, 5:55 AM UTC

desdiv wrote: post #26

latchkey wrote: post #5

Samsung already makes most of their phones in Vietnam. Not a huge difference, other than the lack of tariffs. https://www.economist.com/asia/2018/04/12/why-samsung-of-sou...

There should be more push back against goods made in non-democratic countries like Vietnam, and not just against Made-in-China. My previous phone was a Samsung Galaxy S5 and I was surprised to find out that it was made in Korea. Manufacturing in Korea certainly didn't seem to harm Samsung's financial prospects back then, and the phone wasn't any more expensive than its Made-in-China competitors. I have zero reservati…

That doesn't work out because:

1. Every country is susceptible to change government at any time

2. Corporations are in the game for profit, everything else is a kind of nice to have

Re: Samsung ends mobile phone production in China

#44

Post by AFascistWorld » Thu, Oct 03, 2019, 5:58 AM UTC

latchkey wrote: post #14

hardwaresofton wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder why more producers haven't made this move? If Vietnam is there as far as infrastructure goes and they have the skilled/unskilled labor why is this not a more popular move. Also when we say "make" I assume we mean "assembles". Somewhat anecdotally I recently purchased a laptop and tried to find one that wasn't made in China and it was nigh on impossible.

I'm a tech expat living in Vietnam (from Bay Area) for the last 4 years. This is a really loaded question. You have to look into the politics of the VN govt, especially related to the fact that it is on the northern end of VN, closer to Hanoi... which has different politics than in the south. I've been to Hai Phong, which is the city in the north near the China border where most of this commerce happens. It is fascin…

You can pay something like 50 RMB for them to motorbike you through the jungles into Cambodia or Loas (illegally) without any questions asked.

There are also illegal but protected casinos near the Vietnam-China border entry, that only allow in Chinese nationals.

Re: Samsung ends mobile phone production in China

#45

Post by spats1990 » Thu, Oct 03, 2019, 6:01 AM UTC

yesplorer wrote: post #35

post_below wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'll try it without citations :) Because China is an authoritarian regime that imprisons, and sometimes kills, people for their opinions. Because China systematically destroyed one of the oldest and most peaceful cultures the world has ever seen in Tibet. Because China put 100's of 1000's of Muslims in concentration camps. A program which is still happening by all (non Chinese government) accounts. And so on. Not tha…

Beyond your last point on concentration camp, the US isn't a shining example of "imprisons, and sometimes kills," and "systematically destroyed peaceful cultures" either. And the bail system where poor people can be held for not having money to post bail is akin to decentralized concentration camps around the country. That you can say is a stretch, but you get the point.

"Only the US is allowed to mistreat Muslims and only when the Muslims are foreigners" is a thermonuclear take of mine that I mostly keep to myself, because it doesn't really help anybody and just makes people mad, and because (most importantly imo) two things can be bad at the same time.

Re: Samsung ends mobile phone production in China

#46

Post by pcwalton » Thu, Oct 03, 2019, 6:01 AM UTC

yesplorer wrote: post #35

post_below wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'll try it without citations :) Because China is an authoritarian regime that imprisons, and sometimes kills, people for their opinions. Because China systematically destroyed one of the oldest and most peaceful cultures the world has ever seen in Tibet. Because China put 100's of 1000's of Muslims in concentration camps. A program which is still happening by all (non Chinese government) accounts. And so on. Not tha…

Beyond your last point on concentration camp, the US isn't a shining example of "imprisons, and sometimes kills," and "systematically destroyed peaceful cultures" either. And the bail system where poor people can be held for not having money to post bail is akin to decentralized concentration camps around the country. That you can say is a stretch, but you get the point.

> And the bail system where poor people can be held for not having money to post bail is akin to decentralized concentration camps around the country.

Cash bail should be abolished, but there is absolutely nothing in common between the Chinese government's treatment of the Uighur minority and the practice. There's literally a clause directly targeting this in the 8th Amendment, which has been enforced by the courts at various times to reduce bail. No such recourse is available to inmates of Chinese concentration camps. And the 4th Amendment, which the courts actually enforce, guarantees that you can't be thrown in jail without probable cause to begin with.

Re: Samsung ends mobile phone production in China

#47

Post by tedivm » Thu, Oct 03, 2019, 6:01 AM UTC

anonygler wrote: post #37

throwaway4589 wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't that how Samsung grew during the 90s? Japanese companies outsourced to them, and basically trained their competitors. Manufacturing in Korea during the 90s just accelerated the rate of IP theft. It was like that in Japan during the 80s too. I wonder which country will be after China.

This reeks of whataboutism. IP theft is problematic and nobody has ever engaged in it to the extent that China has. The Chinese intelligence apparatus is actively engaged in IP theft as well.

The entire US Industrial Revolution was kicked off by Francis Cabot Lowell stealing the designs of British power looms. Alexander Hamilton, as treasury secretary, adopted an actual policy of stealing technology and sent spies to Britain as well.

This is how it works. Countries without technology steal it from those that do. It's basically a market force- if you don't make it available at something approaching a reasonable cost then it will be duplicated through research or just directly stolen.

Re: Samsung ends mobile phone production in China

#48

Post by ARandomerDude » Thu, Oct 03, 2019, 6:04 AM UTC

anonygler wrote: post #37

throwaway4589 wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't that how Samsung grew during the 90s? Japanese companies outsourced to them, and basically trained their competitors. Manufacturing in Korea during the 90s just accelerated the rate of IP theft. It was like that in Japan during the 80s too. I wonder which country will be after China.

This reeks of whataboutism. IP theft is problematic and nobody has ever engaged in it to the extent that China has. The Chinese intelligence apparatus is actively engaged in IP theft as well.

> nobody has ever engaged in it to the extent that China has

Translation: what about all the countries that aren't as bad as China?

A certain amount of "whataboutism" is unavoidable if you attempt to make any comparative statments, or believe inductive reasoning is possible.

Re: Samsung ends mobile phone production in China

#49

Post by mikelyons » Thu, Oct 03, 2019, 6:04 AM UTC

hurrdurr2 wrote: post #39

post_below wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'll try it without citations :) Because China is an authoritarian regime that imprisons, and sometimes kills, people for their opinions. Because China systematically destroyed one of the oldest and most peaceful cultures the world has ever seen in Tibet. Because China put 100's of 1000's of Muslims in concentration camps. A program which is still happening by all (non Chinese government) accounts. And so on. Not tha…

You should do some actual research on what exactly the culture in Tibet was like before China took over. Not excusing the behavior of the CCP but look up what the lamas were doing back in the day. It wasn't some Hollywood "paradise" like most people believe.

Are there any human institutions where you _can't_ just say "oh those supposed good people did evil too"?

I'm legitimately curious if evil is struck throughout 'both' sides in any situation ...

Re: Samsung ends mobile phone production in China

#50

Post by ng12 » Thu, Oct 03, 2019, 6:05 AM UTC

hurrdurr2 wrote: post #39

post_below wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'll try it without citations :) Because China is an authoritarian regime that imprisons, and sometimes kills, people for their opinions. Because China systematically destroyed one of the oldest and most peaceful cultures the world has ever seen in Tibet. Because China put 100's of 1000's of Muslims in concentration camps. A program which is still happening by all (non Chinese government) accounts. And so on. Not tha…

You should do some actual research on what exactly the culture in Tibet was like before China took over. Not excusing the behavior of the CCP but look up what the lamas were doing back in the day. It wasn't some Hollywood "paradise" like most people believe.

I wasn't aware human rights had to be earned.