Ask HN: Who Wants to Be Fired? • Hacker News Board

Re: Ask HN: Who Wants to Be Fired?

#281

Post by perl4ever » Thu, Oct 03, 2019, 3:19 AM UTC

dboreham wrote: post #206

perl4ever wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's (purportedly) a quote from the person posting this on HN, not the purchaser of the company.

Ok, but I've never come close to working on healthcare software but I've run up against HIPAA numerous times because partners, customers, suppliers, customers of customers, are in that space. So the idea that your company can buy a full-on healthcare software business but you and your legal people have never heard of it is pretty hard to swallow.

I agree, but my point was that it wasn't the buffoonish CEO that the quote was attributed to, but the HN poster who's bragging about his talent, wealth, and illegal activities.

Re: Ask HN: Who Wants to Be Fired?

#282

Post by alexk » Thu, Oct 03, 2019, 3:19 AM UTC

seizethecheese wrote: post #267

I sure hope this format doesn't take off. Having worked as a dishwasher, line cook, pool manager, business analyst, software engineer, and startup founder, I have to say software engineer was, by far, the most coddled job. How about this: I'm a line cook, and I can't afford to be fired. I make minimum wage, and burn or cut myself badly at least once per week. I'm not allowed to take the day off and have to work throu…

I agree with you that line cook is a very hard job and I have nothing but respect for all the workers out there facing daily harsh conditions.

Having said that, I also understand that mental problems caused by stress at work, the abuse and pressure some intellectual workers face is as real and dangerous, however is less visible.

That's why I think that people reading this should not underestimate those dangers and look for a change from those conditions regardless of whether they come from mental or physical sides of our jobs.

Re: Ask HN: Who Wants to Be Fired?

#283

Post by seizethecheese » Thu, Oct 03, 2019, 3:20 AM UTC

xpe wrote: post #276

seizethecheese wrote: post #267

I sure hope this format doesn't take off. Having worked as a dishwasher, line cook, pool manager, business analyst, software engineer, and startup founder, I have to say software engineer was, by far, the most coddled job. How about this: I'm a line cook, and I can't afford to be fired. I make minimum wage, and burn or cut myself badly at least once per week. I'm not allowed to take the day off and have to work throu…

People at all ranges of life experience have authentic concerns. Listening can be hard, because, yes, we might hear stories of things that seem, well, entitled. That’s ok. Perhaps people that take too much for granted can reassess by putting their stories out and getting feedback?

Yes, that would be constructive. My fear is that often, these threads devolve into devs enabling each other's entitlement rather than illuminating it.

Re: Ask HN: Who Wants to Be Fired?

#284

Post by idlewords » Thu, Oct 03, 2019, 3:20 AM UTC

whatshisface wrote: post #279

seizethecheese wrote: post #267

I sure hope this format doesn't take off. Having worked as a dishwasher, line cook, pool manager, business analyst, software engineer, and startup founder, I have to say software engineer was, by far, the most coddled job. How about this: I'm a line cook, and I can't afford to be fired. I make minimum wage, and burn or cut myself badly at least once per week. I'm not allowed to take the day off and have to work throu…

I'm a third world sweathop worker. I was forced to make clothes here ever since I could walk. There are hundreds of people packed in to this tiny windowless room, and every time there is a fire I die. My coworkers can't even afford alcohol. Every time I hear decadent American line cooks complain about their working conditions, all I can think is, they have it so easy.

Get off the internet and back to work!

Re: Ask HN: Who Wants to Be Fired?

#285

Post by seizethecheese » Thu, Oct 03, 2019, 3:21 AM UTC

whatshisface wrote: post #279

seizethecheese wrote: post #267

I sure hope this format doesn't take off. Having worked as a dishwasher, line cook, pool manager, business analyst, software engineer, and startup founder, I have to say software engineer was, by far, the most coddled job. How about this: I'm a line cook, and I can't afford to be fired. I make minimum wage, and burn or cut myself badly at least once per week. I'm not allowed to take the day off and have to work throu…

I'm a third world sweathop worker. I was forced to make clothes here ever since I could walk. There are hundreds of people packed in to this tiny windowless room, and every time there is a fire I die. My coworkers can't even afford alcohol. Every time I hear decadent American line cooks complain about their working conditions, all I can think is, they have it so easy.

Yes, this illuminates the point even better. Software devs are among the best treated first world employees. In a global perspective, most (but not all) complaints are laughable.

Re: Ask HN: Who Wants to Be Fired?

#286

Post by catlifeonmars » Thu, Oct 03, 2019, 3:21 AM UTC

eropple wrote: post #177

perl4ever wrote: post #174

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The story exceeds my suspension of disbelief. What particular jumps out at me is the backwards details - nobody off the street knows what "TPA" means, sure, but everybody who's ever gone to see a doctor knows what HIPAA is, even if they think it's called "HIPPA".

Maybe it's bull. But it has the ring of truth to it, to me, and I've worked for a few healthcare startups. A lot of developers think of themselves as "just developers" and a lot of people are brutally incurious about the world until it hits them in the face.

> ... are brutally incurious ...

This is an amazing phrase.

Re: Ask HN: Who Wants to Be Fired?

#287

Post by woutr_be » Thu, Oct 03, 2019, 3:22 AM UTC

seizethecheese wrote: post #278

NullPrefix wrote: post #275

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm sure there are worse jobs than line cook. If someone would provide a description of a worse job, would that invalidate your argument in the same way you tried to invalidate OPs argument?

Of course not. And there are better jobs than software engineer. However, I do believe it's possible to stack rank jobs, and Software Engineer must be in the top quintile in terms of quality of work-life.

Because it's a cozy job in the US? Software Engineers face horrible working conditions in a lot of parts of Asia, far worse than your line cook example.

Re: Ask HN: Who Wants to Be Fired?

#288

Post by AmericanChopper » Thu, Oct 03, 2019, 3:22 AM UTC

DamnInteresting wrote: post #261

AmericanChopper wrote: post #247

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This approach really depends on the manager. A manager who has a habit of bullying people will have no issues laying on more pressure/guilt/whatever... in this situation. Personally, if I feel as though a manager has expected me to do something outside my contract, I just don’t even give it any thought. That’s their problem. If they bring it up I just tell them no in a rather blunt way. I’ve worked with plenty of bul…

As an introvert, what I like about this approach is that it does not close any doors, it just opens a discussion. Ofttimes that discussion is rapidly helpful. When it is not—when the manager is a bully, or oblivious—I still have the option to be more blunt. It's a diplomatic first foray into tricky topics.

Whatever works for you is great. I’d just suggest you be careful that you don’t first establish yourself as somebody who will tolerate bullying. Once you’ve laid the groundwork for that, undoing it can be much harder than just avoiding it in the first place.

Re: Ask HN: Who Wants to Be Fired?

#289

Post by perl4ever » Thu, Oct 03, 2019, 3:22 AM UTC

eropple wrote: post #177

perl4ever wrote: post #174

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The story exceeds my suspension of disbelief. What particular jumps out at me is the backwards details - nobody off the street knows what "TPA" means, sure, but everybody who's ever gone to see a doctor knows what HIPAA is, even if they think it's called "HIPPA".

Maybe it's bull. But it has the ring of truth to it, to me, and I've worked for a few healthcare startups. A lot of developers think of themselves as "just developers" and a lot of people are brutally incurious about the world until it hits them in the face.

Yeah, but the world generally hits you in the face by the time you turn 18 or maybe even before.

Re: Ask HN: Who Wants to Be Fired?

#290

Post by protomyth » Thu, Oct 03, 2019, 3:24 AM UTC

whateveracct wrote: post #227

rjplatte wrote: post #100

I'm the sole developer working on my current project, which is overhauling a massive DOS era application, as well as overhauling an early 2000s era CRM/business management tool, that almost all of our work happens through. Did I mention that the DOS application is a HIPAA billing application that must meet all HIPAA guidelines as well as write EDI X12 billing files? I'm very junior, been coding for ~5 years, 3 profes…

If you're that young (18??), you can almost definitely afford to quit tomorrow and look for something better. Never sacrifice your own career for your employer's success (within some time horizon.) Being willing to quit when your boss is a clear bad actor is a core part of this.

If you're that young (18??), you can almost definitely afford to quit tomorrow and look for something better.

It very probably is the opposite. A lot of people who end up working at 18 are doing it because they need the money and their support network is poor.